If you need more reason than this to never carry condition 3, I don’t know what to tell you. A pistol with an empty chamber is only a hammer, and glocks make a piss poor hammer.
https://www.guns.com/news/2018/11/27/fatal-wyoming-bear-attack-no-round-in-the-chamber-on-handgun
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Happened where I live, Didn’t know him personally but interacted with his Blue Sky Restoration Business on occasion.
After this happen, The JH Gun Range had an upsurge in people bringing out large caliber revolvers and such.
Most after a box of 44mag or a cylinder or 2 of 454 casull called it good an thought they were good to go.
As a range officer I suggested they try it from the draw wearing whatever clothing and backpacks they would have on.
Most looked at me like I was from another planet.
I have a friend that has built a charging bear target with a realistic closing speed. It’s an eye opener to try and clear a chest holster while wearing a backpack when you know he’s launched it. Imagine trying that without any warning.
I’d be willing to be complacency killed him as much as anything. When you’ve walked past 100 grizzlies without incident you start to think you are somehow special and that the people who get attacked “must have done something wrong.”
Not everyone has the mindset that says “Nothing bad has happened for a hundred incidents but TODAY it will probably all go wrong and for no particular reason at all.”
People who actively train for bear attacks, like the individual AKDoug mentioned, are few and far between. Most people simply get complacent and over confident in their ability and response time. Even people who hunt and kill grizzlies sometimes assume they will always have control of any situation.
Had something similar, a stuffed bear on a gravity pulley system…
Back to bear at buzzer , bear was released (charging) had to turn around and get a shot off…
Sounds like a bad situation all around. A little more detail here (and as Steyr said, plenty of evidence of complacency):
As the bear first hit Uptain, who carried bear spray in a hip-slung holster, Chubon went for a Glock that his guide had left with their gear a few yards uphill. For some reason, he could not get the handgun to fire. When the female grizzly diverted her attention away from Uptain and toward the Floridian, he tossed the pistol to his guide. Evidently, it didn’t make it to Uptain, who was a lifelong elk hunter, small-business owner and family man.
Within moments, the bear turned back toward Uptain. Chubon, whose leg, chest and arms were lacerated by the bruin, ran for his life. His last view of Uptain, which he relayed to investigators, was of the guide on his feet trying to fight off the sow
The gun was carried in a shoulder holster, but Uptain had taken it off and set it aside to help the hunter dress out the elk carcass. He still had bear spray on him, but wasn’t able to deploy it until after the bear was on him. The hunter had no firearm (and apparently no familiarity with Uptain’s glock), even though they were there to finish dressing and pack out an elk killed the previous day.
Uptain survived the first attack (though by then the hunter, Chubon was already gone) and at some point was able to hike 50ft up a hillside before being mauled a second time, killing him. Neither the guide nor the hunter had GPS emergency beacons (or a sat phone), so the wounded hunter had to hike to their horses and then ride up a ridge to call for help with his cell phone.
A tragedy for Uptain’s family no matter how you cut it.
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The original Breaking story…Local
https://www.jhnewsandguide.com/the_hole_scroll/article_8f2ed9ed-8942-522d-9000-d294eb622dfa.html
I’ve worked with a few brown bears. They are no joke. Predators to their core. Very large predators. They are about the only animal that truly scares me. You can’t outrun them, you can’t out swim or out dive them, you can’t hide in a car or cabin because they can simply tear it open if they want to, they move so damn fast and they can be so sneaky, you’d be lucky to even get a shot off, much less a hit… You might be able to climb a tree to get away from one, but it would have to be a very large tree and you’d have to go pretty high, pretty quickly, which isn’t likely because you won’t even know they are there until its too late. Frankly, I’m surprised this doesn’t happen more often.
Condolences to the man’s family. So sad.
No, no and no. You don’t traverse rural grizzly bear country with a 10mm Glock (with no round in the pipe) and a client with a bow and arrow. Our biggest predators in this part of New Mexico are the black bear and mountain lion, and we see quite a few of the latter. At an absolute minimum when I’m after a big cat is my JM Marlin Guide Gun in 45-70, or Winchester 94 in 30-30, plus a Ruger GP100 in .357 loaded with Buffalo Bore 180 grain bullets. I have other options but this is just one, and the lever action will always have a round in the chamber.
What a shame but I guess you can get too comfortable in your surroundings.
That really sucks. But when you are creating what is essentially a bear buffet, someone should have been on over watch with no less than a .308, preferably a high capacity semi auto. This was completely preventable.
Initially I assumed somebody got ambushed by an unseen bear and simply didn’t have time to draw, rack and shoot. This is even worse, wouldn’t have mattered if there was one in the chamber or not. I also think that handguns really aren’t suitable for bear country, especially if you are covered in elk blood.
An ar or 308 isn’t the answer to everything. When you’re a hammer, every problem starts to look like a nail.
He should have not had an empty chamber should not have put his weapon down. Yes, mistakes were made, but not having a designated marksman platoon securing a perimeter isn’t one of them. I don’t archery hunt, so not familiar with the laws, but if I remember right, you can’t have a rifle with you while bow hunting. So all of that is out there window.
Good situational awareness, not being complacent, keeping the gun handy and condition 1 would have helped.
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Not sure I want to trust my survival to a 10mm Glock when I’m covered in Elk blood. Situational awareness is no guarantee either, wouldn’t be the first time a bear blindsided somebody with less than 10 feet of warning.
If the laws for bow hunting state you can’t have a rifle, then those are some really stupid laws and you’ll never catch me bow hunting with such absurd restrictions.
I also disagree with needing a marksman securing the perimeter. I wouldn’t advocate it for everywhere but certain places starting with “A” such as Africa or Alaska where things have been known to hunt humans, you better believe it should be SOP.
And bears aren’t the only thing. One time my father and a buddy were hunting in Canada (pretty sure it was bear) in the late 70s and a couple days into the hunt they realized it wasn’t a careless hunter who had taken two shots at them but somebody who was actually trying to kill them. Needless to say it was a long week for them and it would be years before I got the real story.
But suffice to say, I generally don’t screw around in the woods with just a handgun or a bow. Also when it comes to lions and tigers and bears, I don’t assume it will be “only one at a time” so I generally try to cheat in my favor as much as possible. But mostly I just try to avoid the lions, tigers and bears as much as possible and there are few reasons for me to be in their neighborhood.
This.
I had an Inuit native in my squad at basic training, he lived on Kodiak Island. I asked him what it was like to live around that type of predator. He said, and I quote, “ you live carefully.” He then added with a smile that between salmon and photographers, they were seldom hungry.
Hearsay, I know, but the outfitter that was packing my elk off the mountain this year claimed to have worked with the guide in question over the last few years. He (the packer) told me that the guide had also been concerned over litigation if he were ever forced to kill a bear in self-defense. This is not uncommon thinking among those who live in grizzly country.
We hunt elk every year in areas known to be home to aggressive bears and with a history of bear attacks, especially during archery elk season. Never hunt alone and always have someone standing watch when tending to a kill. If that someone would have a long arm, even better.
Agreed. There’s no guarantee having someone watching for bear would’ve prevented the attack, but at the very least it may have been enough to end the attack early and possibly save the guide’s life. Bear spray works best if you are aware of a bear’s presence early enough to deploy it correctly, and can end a confrontation before a firearm is needed. But in either case (spray or gun) you have to be able to react in time.
Agreed, for the most part. A bolt gun or big bore lever gun wouldn’t have helped any more than the handgun if it have been left yards away with an empty chamber. As for long guns, there is no law against carrying long guns in Wyoming while hunting during archery season (at least partly because of their usefulness for protection against bear and lion).
From the Wyoming Game & Fish Website:
Can I carry a firearm while archery hunting during the archery season? Yes. However, the law does prohibit the use of firearms in taking or finishing off any big or trophy game animals during the special archery season.
The catch is being able to show that you shot the bear in self defense, and not as a trophy.
With the Grizzly population having grow to the point that game & fish approved a Grizzly season in Wyoming for the first time since 1974 (though it’s currently blocked by a federal judge due to a law suit filed by an environmentalist group), I’d say it wouldn’t be unreasonable. Bear numbers are over 600 this year in the Teton area of Wyo, up from 136 in 1975 when they ended hunting. Encounters with humans are way up.
Solid advice for sure. I can understand the concern about being held liable for killing a bear. I would think the sooner you see one the less likely you are to have to kill it.
You would find it amazing that the residents of Kodiak are some of the most bear relaxed people you’ll ever encounter. I spend time down there every year visiting friends that have lived there their whole lives. You will find hundreds of residents that fish and hike with no firearms at all, lodge owners that go about their daily duties without a rifle in sight, and hunters that hunt deer with .243’s instead of large caliber rifles. Bears on Kodiak are different than bears elsewhere. They are primarily foragers of plants and fish eaters. Yes, a couple people have been munched on Kodiak, but it is exceedingly rare considering how many people live and recreate in close proximity to its large bear population.
Grizzly bears in our interior are far more aggressive and troublesome. Bears are smart. In areas where they are hunted heavily, they are less likely to encounter humans. We have a fairly large local population of bears and they never really give us trouble because there is a very liberal season on them. Kodiak is the same way. A history of hunting has pretty much taught bears that humans are bad.
Wondering how fast a bear can move? Watch this video taken by my friend Jake. Mature Kodiak blacktail deer will hit 150 to 175# and this one was that big. That bear RAN off with a man sized animal.
I don’t recommend playing with bears. But I don’t personally find coastal brown bears all that scary. Moose and bears from the interior that are working a lot harder for calories scare me a lot more. They have a brain that’s very similar to a dog. If you run and scream they’re much more likely to pounce you out of instinct.
Me doing dumb shit with the big puppy dogs.
You said “dumb shit” not me. I wouldn’t have been that generous.
Safer than crossing the street in some cities. Photography tours are a huge part of the tourism business in many coastal areas. I don’t recall a single instance of a coastal brown bear mauling a photographer in those circumstances.