Ok so i have now spent a day or so in the army, and some of my scout snipers want me to get involved with long range shooting. being a doc, it wasnt really my interest, since, well, i know more about plugging bullet holes than making them. finally I broke down and bought a remington 700 aac model chambered in .308. now im looking for optics for it and im fond of the vortex brand. I need someting thats good for 800-1200 yards in a mil dot or mrad. if any experienced shooters out there could lend some advice, id appreciate it. also id like to keep the price less than 1000 dollars. stay safe guys- Docchinn
Vortex Viper PST 6-24x50 FFP. Its gonna take some practice to get out to 1200 yards with a .308 but that scope will get you headed in the right direction and is in your price range at $999 per their web page.
Take a look at the Weaver tacticals on SWFA or Midway. Good prices and nice reviews. I have the 3-10X40 and love it. I could only imagine what the next step up would be.
I don’t know what the military price is off the top of my head, I think it’s a little bit over $1k, but the Bushnell HDMR is a fantastic scope. Call HORUS and ask them about the military pricing. I’d go for the H59. It’s very robust, and excellent quality. Don’t let the name on it fool you. It’s pretty short too. You might see a used one on some of the long gunner forums within your price range.
On my Savage .308, I just retired the Bushnell Elite 4200 6-24x50 FFP I had on it and installed a Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50 FFP. Both are mildot/mil turret. As Silver said, 1200 yds with the .308 Win is going to take some real input from you, but you can’t go wrong with the Vortex glass, IMO.
Call Scott @ Liberty Optics. Get a 6-24 vortex PST with your choice of reticle and knobs. Make sure to get a ffp model. Best thing going in the under $1k price point. The weavers and bushnell stuff is nice, but doesn’t have the feature-set that the vortex has. I’ve used all 3. Vortex PST is the clear winner for the dollar spent.
If you intend to shoot to 1200yds with that 20" barrel, you’ll want to use 175SMK or berger 180’s. I prefer the sierra, as they are more forgiving on seating depth and can be set up to run from the magazine and still be accurate. Berger’s usually need to be jammed to run right. If shooting with real snipers… that will piss them off, if you intend on having them help you anyway. So, plan to run from the mag. You’ll need a stout load of varget too. You’ll likely not see much more than 2550fps from that barrel. Maybe 2650 on the very highest end. (dangerous in most 20" guns)
If factory ammo is your thing, then go with a 175gr offering from black hills, Cor Bon, or FGMM.
If you are serious about shooting that distance with that rifle… plan on changing the stock, and the trigger. If it’s a good tube, it’ll be able to do it with the proper loads.
You are in for an adventure, that’s for sure. Be ready to learn, and if you have any questions… post em.
I went with a NF NXS 5.5-22x56 SFP on my Comp gun & have been very pleased with it.
BTW, 1200 yards with a 20" barrel? I don’t know if you can do it & be consistent. I started with an SPS Tac & FGMM 175 grainers were going subsonic at around 900 yds. Handloading some HOT 155 grain loads may help, but I don’t know about 1200 yds. I switched to a Rem 5R & had no probs after with the longer barrel. Good luck!
No offense, but can you do it consistently & be competative? I shoot long range competitions monthly, & despite what the internet says, the guys who shoot worth a darn run hot handloads through a 24" MINIMUM length barrel. There are no AR .308’s & no short barreled bolt guns which everyone says are the hot ticket these days.
All in all, I won’t argue that it can be done. I tried the short barrel thing & it didn’t work well enough to be competative. Not even close.
AR308’s and short barrel bolts are the hot ticket these days for real world use not long range competition. The average police sniper shot is at 55 yards. A gun that is handy and manuverable is more valuable in the real world than one that can reach futher out but is bulking and heavy. You just have to pick the right tool for the job.
That may be true, but unless my eyes deceive me the threadstarter is specifically asking for optics for long range shooting. He even stated he was interested in shooting 800-1200 yards. The fact that police engagements are short range really doesn’t have anything to do with what the threadstarter is talking about, and a1fabweld’s point that this recent internet obsession with short barreled bolt guns doesn’t actually carry over to those who really shoot long range and do well is valid and relevant.
How does me saying it “can be done, if the wind isn’t blowing” translate to “yeah, its the best for long range shooting” in your mind? It’s hard to take offense when you clearly didn’t even understand what the hell was said.
Yes I can consistently hit an IPSC steel at 1000yds with my 18" bolt gun ---- So long as the wind is blowing 5mph or less, and its not gusty. In winds higher than that… my percentage drops drastically.
Didn’t stop me from beating the pants off of people with it last summer at a long range match. They had hot cartridges and I flat out embarrassed them with my lowly 18" 308.
Would I use it as a first choice? No. But I wanted to see how well I could do with it when pressure was applied.
Do you understand what I’m saying now? I’d hate to make it too clear. Let me try some more. If the wind is not blowing, I can probably be consistent at 1000yds with a .223 using 52gr HP’s. ANYONE could. It isn’t hard to dope the gun and stick the crosshair on the target and break the trigger. Wind reading, THAT is what separates marksmen from the rest of the herd.
So yes, beings you want to argue with me whilst agreeing… I’ll argue back whilst agreeing. A 20" 308 in capable hands, is at a SEVERE disadvantage to a 26" barreled 308 in capable hands. Doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure this out.
Run the numbers on a 155 scenar or something with a .500 or close BC going 2900fps via 28" barrel VS a 175SMK with a .490 BC going 2550fps via 18" barrel. Those velocities are easily attainable in those barrel lengths with those bullets. Even a 175SMK going 2650 - 2700 out of a 26" tube is going to STOMP all over an 18" tube spitting them out at 2550. I’ve had 3 different 18" barrels and none of them would run faster than 2550 with a safe load of varget and 175’s. I could get 155’s up around 2700, but that is not fast enough to trump 175’s going slower.
So, a1fabweld would you like to argue whilst agreeing some more? … or would you instead like to take my words at face value meaning exactly what I said: It CAN be done, when the wind isn’t blowing. :suicide2:
With the experience you have stated your gun is good to 800 yards with 1k being possible with some training and experience.
The 308 is a good round and can reach 1k+ behind a TRAINED person with competent equipment.
With your 20" barrel 308 I would concentrate on 500-800 yard shooting and work up from there. Im no expert at this and have no formal training in LR shooting just been a DIY type of guy in your shoes at one point.
If you want to make the most of of your gun start short and work big later on. No one is going to pull out even a perfectly zero’d AI 338 and ring plates out at 1k without any instruction. I have been lucky and befriended some really good guys over the past few years who do have formal training, and done quite good.
1200 yards is a long fucking way away no matter what anyone says, and 308 can drift FEET with just a few different MPH side wind. I find LR shooting very challenging yet very fun. Just don’t go out there expecting dings on steel not knowing what you are doing. Do lots of reading, too. Snipers Hide forums has tons of information to make you a better shooter and let you know better what is going on out there.
FWIW with a lot of rounds down range and a lot of helpful advice & personal research I could shoot better with a 308 than most people I saw on the range with magnum bolt actions with much higher power scopes. I shot a 1-4X out to 750 yards quite successfully while dudes with gigantic bolt action setups were struggling to hit the same LaRue pop ups. At the range I go to you have to qualify at 250 yards, 500, 750 and then you can shoot 1k. Its incredible how many people have trouble just at 250. Ive seen people expend 40 rounds in a row trying to get 3 hits in a row at a 500 yard torso sized plate and fail.
Just have fun but try to learn along the way. The more you learn the more fun it will become as 500 yard hits become routine, and 1k yard hits challenge you.
HAHA! WOW! I didn’t mean to rub your vagina the wrong way there cupcake. Take a deep breath & relax. This is internet chat with strangers. Don’t take it so personal. You keep going on about “If the wind isn’t blowing”, blah, blah, blah. So what do you tell the guys next to you at a match when you feel your skirt blow up a little with the slightest breeze? “Sorry guys, I have to wait for perfect conditions before I take a shot”. Please. At our range you’d get laughed out before the match was over. I’d love to see you clean house at a 1K match with your 18"er. I call bullshit on that claim. One of the best shots at our 1K range tried it with a tight chambered 18" barrel & keyholed every shot past about 800-900. This guy knows his shit, I’ve personally seen his custom rifles win matches, & even he couldn’t make an 18"er work with 155’s or 175’s.
For f’s sake. He knows his shit and is keyholing past 900? HAHAHA!
Right.
I’ve got hits as far out as 1544yds with my 18", and they did not keyhole. So your guy better get his act together when it comes to bullet selection and load development. … cupcake.
I truly don’t get you. I really do not. I agree with you that the 18" is no good for competition… yet you consistently read my statements as saying the exact opposite. I figure you must drink heavily when at the keyboard.
Do you ALWAYS argue with people that agree with you? … or do you just do it sometimes?
I see you’re the type that always has to be right. I think your stories are bullshit & don’t believe you make solid 1K hits let alone 1200+ yard hits with your sawed off internet commando sniper rig. Thicken up your skin a little & stop taking the little shit so personally. That’s right, take a deep breath Mr. Hathcock. It’ll be ok.
