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Anyone drive a diesel? What’s the payoff/value?
It seems that diesel is probably cheaper in the long run, but in the short-term it’s more vulnerable to sudden, dramatic shifts in price?
I’ve got a 1 ton GMC with the Duramax diesel. When I bought it, I was comparing it to big block gas motors like the GM 8.1L and the Ford V10. I also assumed that diesel and gas averaged about the same price over the course of a year (diesel is cheaper in the summer but more expensive in the winter). The current prices are just crazy.
Compared to the V10 or a big block V8, the money will even out over time (like 70k to 100k miles) when I did my research about a year ago. The increased efficiency of the diesel will eventually make up for the initial investment. This is the fairest comparison as these are the only gas motors to come close to the diesel in power and torque.
When up against a smaller V8 like the Hemi, 5.4L Ford, or the GM 6.0 you’ll never make that money up, especially with the cost of diesel creeping up and staying up. Of course they are in a whole different league power wise, so it’s not a fair comparison. Both Ford and GM are coming out with smaller displacement diesels in the next few years, it will be interesting to see how they stack up.
If you need the power of a diesel to tow something heavy, there just is no substitute. They really have no peer, and they are more efficient than a big gas motor. But if you just want a truck to haul stuff and occasionally tow, a 1/2 ton or V8 3/4 ton makes more sense.
Diesel cars really have not caught on in the US. And our regs aren’t going to make it easier. The costly new ULSD diesel and tight emission requirements make it tough for a diesel to make financial sense. A diesel is usually thousands more than a gas motor, and with the increased cost of the fuel it’s tougher to make that money up. Bonus points are that you can use biodiesel and tell Big Oil to stick it. An eco-type at work uses B100 (100% biodiesel) in his Jetta TDI and gets 35-40 mpg, and none of it comes from an oil company. His fuel is usually at least 50 cents more than dino diesel though. I’ve seen a lot of car magazines rate the BMW and Audi diesels in Europe as highly as their gas counterparts, which is much different than during the 80’s when diesel cars were slugs, even compared to the emasculated gas engines of the time.
So diesel may be worth it… IF you want to invest in a higher-end German diesel?
Does your green buddy at work have to pay for the french fry oil?
Audi makes the most amazing diesels. They won LeMans a few years ago with a diesel, and will be putting a diesel motor in their R8 supercar.
Problem is most of those diesels are way expensive. VW made some of their Jettas, Bugs, Golfs, and Passats with a nice little diesel motor. Those are the ones to get if you are after efficiency.
My buddy buys his B100 from local dealers, he doesn’t mix his own. It’s spendy, and they are not as convienent as regular gas stations, but they are out there. I won’t put it in my $50k truck, but a $5000 used VW would be no problem.
these gas prices are out of control. hell, a gallon of gas costs almost as much as a cup of starbuck’s coffee!!! :eek:
when i hear people who drink starbucks complain about the price of gas, i tell them that the frap they’re drinking costs 6 times more than gas per gallon, and that helps put things into perspective and makes them think twice about their spending habits. needless to say, i don’t drink starbucks - that’s ammo money, man.
89 octane was $ 3.71 at 1:00 pm . 10 hours later $3.85 . what the fuck !!!
My girl has a Diesel Jetta, and IMHO it is the way to go. Typically over time, diesel is more stable; as the train/trucking industry helps keep it from fluctuating as much as gas. It has really only been in the past months that it jumped up higher than gas if I remember correctly. I really look forward to it settling out and gas going up above diesel this summer. Really, it should be cheaper as from my understanding, there are not as many steps involved in refining diesel as there is gas. Her car gets somewhere from 42 mpg to 48 mpg; just depending on how it is driven. That combined with the fact that if times got bad, we could fill up at McDonalds in the middle of the night and be GTG, I dig the diesel.
The ultimate economy car.
http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2007/01/rabbit_diesel_ad.jpg
Something needs to be done. Right Ephing now.
deisel in new york is almost $5.00 a gallon - so much for being cheaper
The question would be is what is the cost of regular. Assuming diesel gets 40% better mileage.
on a 20 gallon diesel tank it would be $100 fillup at 40miles to the gallon…you go 800 miles. 1 dollar per 8 miles.
at 20 gallon gasoline tank (assuming 25 mpg and $4/gallon) $80 you go 500 miles. 1 dollar per 6.25 miles.
This only is a gas cost.
Diesel here in California is always 5-10 cents more than primium gas. The reason diesel has topped everything else is 1) it is now a processed fuel. Before ULSD was mandated diesel was really a left over from the process than refined oil to gas. Now it has to be refined as well to get the sulfer content down. 2) and i beleve the biggest reason diesel cost so much is some gready bastard relized that this entire country runs off of diesel. If the trucking industry shut down for three days we would have entire towns running out of food and fuel and that would lead us to some big problems when the panick set.
$3.66 here in Arlington Va yesterday.
Last time I filled up the price was $3.37 at the exxon by work (university bld and georgia ave) in wheaton.
Ahmadinejad Says Oil at $115 a Barrel is Too Low, Calls for Higher Prices
TEHRAN, Iran — Iran’s hard-line President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was quoted Saturday as saying crude oil prices at $115 a barrel are too low, and that oil must “discover its real value.”
Oil prices have hit all-time highs above $115 a barrel in recent weeks, amid reports that oil and gasoline stocks in the United States were lower than expected and as the dollar sinks to record lows.
“The oil price of $115 a barrel in today’s global markets is a deceiving figure. Oil is a strategic commodity that needs to discover its real value,” the Web site of Iran’s state-run television quoted Ahmadinejad as saying.
The Iranian president made the remarks during a visit to an oil and gas exhibition in Tehran late Friday.
Crude oil futures surged to a new trading record of $117 a barrel Friday following an attack on a key pipeline in Nigeria. The rise capped a week of record highs fueled by supply woes and the dollar’s weakness relative to other major currencies.
Ahmadinejad said despite the surge in oil prices, the economic value of crude oil is currently less than what it was in 1980.
“While the price of other commodities have increased, the economic value of the current oil price is even less than 1980,” he said.
Ahmadinejad accused Western industrialized nations of “selfishness” in their quest for cheaper oil.
“When they get hold of oil, they assume that oil is a free commodity and belongs to them and has wrongly been placed in other territories… This is the spirit of selfishness and arrogance,” Ahmadinejad was quoted as saying.
A host of supply and demand concerns in the U.S. and abroad, along with the dollar’s weakness, have bolstered oil prices, even as record retail gasoline prices in the U.S. appear to be dampening demand.
A stronger dollar makes commodities such as oil less attractive to investors as a hedge against inflation, and it makes oil more expensive to investors overseas. Analysts believe the weaker dollar is the primary reason oil has soared well past $100 a barrel this year. But the effect tends to reverse when the greenback gains ground.
Ahmadinejad called the U.S. currency “a handful of paper” without any global support.
Iran has stopped using the U.S. dollar in its oil transactions with the outside world, switching to other non-dollar currencies such as Euro.
“The dollar is not money any longer but a handful of paper distributed in the world without commodity support,” the Web site quoted Ahmadinejad as saying.
(Retrieved from http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,351789,00.html on April 21, 2008.)
So, we’re just a bunch of cry babies or TANSTAAFL, huh? No!
Drivers paying record pump prices
By Chelsea Emery
NEW YORK (Reuters) - U.S. drivers are paying record prices to fill their gas tanks and they could see prices surge as much as 30 cents more per gallon over the next few weeks, according to an industry analyst.
U.S. average retail gasoline prices hit a record $3.4737 per gallon on April 18, up 15.66 cents from the April 4 average, according to the nationwide Lundberg survey of about 7,000 gas stations.
Higher driving costs come at a tough time for U.S. consumers, who are already struggling with higher food prices, a slowing economy, job losses and sinking home prices. In addition, surges in gasoline demand during the peak driving months of June, July and August and higher costs could force motorists to cut back on their vacation travel plans, or reduce spending in other areas.
“Behind the record-high pump prices are other record highs that are less visible to the naked eye of the motorist, including record high crude oil prices and a record number of regulations that are adding costs to refining,” said survey editor Trilby Lundberg.
The WTI crude oil futures price closed at $116.69 per barrel on April 18, up from $106.23 on April 4, she said.
Boosting gas prices still more, regulatory mandates are calling for increasing levels of ethanol to be added to gasoline. That’s raising expenses for refiners. In addition, the costs of spring reformulations of gasoline will also hurt prices at the pump.
Refiners and retailers have not yet fully passed on their higher costs to consumers, Lundberg said. When they do, prices will shoot higher.
“If crude oil prices do not retreat, then we will see somewhere between 10 cents to 30 cents rise in the retail price of gasoline, probably in the next few weeks,” Lundberg said.
So far this year, the price of gasoline has climbed 53.47 cents per gallon, Lundberg said.
CALIFORNIANS, TRUCKERS HURT
Californians are paying the most for their gas, with average prices in San Francisco reaching $3.88 per gallon. Some gas stations are charging as much as $4 per gallon, Lundberg said.
California is the biggest state consumer of gasoline.
Trucking companies, too, are paying more for their fuel. That could boost prices for a range of goods that are transported, including produce and consumer products.
The average U.S. retail diesel fuel price on the 18th of April hit $4.2134 per gallon, up 15.13 cents.
The lowest average gasoline price was $3.21 a gallon in Newark, New Jersey. Taxes account for most of the disparity in prices between California and New Jersey. Taxes in Newark add about 33 cents per gallon to the cost of gas, while in San Francisco, motorists pay about 68 cents per gallon toward taxes.
(Retrieved from http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN2045108220080420?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true on April 21, 2008.)
Ah, a complicated issue that will continue to be an expensive issue for consumers and our economy.
Heated rhetoric of holocaust deniers aside, any economic power they have is what we GIVE them.
At $117/barrel there is ample incentive for the market to produce alternatives and shift to short-term solutions such as nuclear and coal. Greenpeace is going to have to pound some sand.
In the long-term, the short-term instability of oil prices will play to our benefit. Once a viable alternative comes online, the price of oil will drop faster than a prom dress. At that point, one-trick-pony oil-based economies like Iran and Venezuela will find they’re sitting on the biggest bubble since the Great Tulip Depression. They will have literally killed the golden goose.
In the meantime, to get to that point, we have to put up with record gas prices, but our economy can withstand a shift from oil, theirs cannot.
I know, it really really sucks, but if your theory of “economic warfare” is correct than we are in a much better strategic position.
$3.65 here. Heh. Not a good time to be a Jeep or truck owner. 
-B
What?! Everyday is a blessed day when you’re a Jeep owner. Irie mon…irie. 
Although my 14.2 mpg does suck. :eek:
CNN Quick Vote
Are rising gas prices cutting into your food budget?
Yes 76% 83590 No 24% 27075Total Votes: 110665
(Retrieved from http://www.cnn.com on April 21, 2008.)
Well, on the bright side Americans will get skinnier! :rolleyes:
Man, I agree with you every day I’m not filling up. It’s that one damn day at the station that puts me off, and it just so happens to be today.
On the other hand, I’ve learned some new drafting techniques, and that it doesn’t work when the vehicle in front of you is small.
-B