I was saying there is always a person who can learn to build, but will choose to buy.
I wasn’t confirming Nitrox’ position on building himself because he can put an AK together. I wasn’t saying “If you can build an AK, you can build a 1911.”
I was comparing it to something he knows well- that some buy and some build…
ETA: It sure isn’t as easy as changing your own oil either but you understood that point…
The first one is gonig to a member on this board. I know that he will not baby it. The first one might turn into a collectors item if I continue on with this project though.
As you know, the REAL cost of a quality 1911 is NEVER in the parts, but in the fitting, polishing, blending of the parts. The guy I am using spends 15 hours on body work alone! These are also Cerakoted (a $300 dollar option).
If people believe that they can buy all the parts, assemble, fit, finish and coat the gun for $2,500 then they can be my guest.
It is not lost on me that 1911 people are a PITA. As I said, this is a labor of love more than anything. I am even going to the extreme of getting PPM to make me a one of a kind pistol case for each 1911 I produce.
Its not a belief, I can absolutely buy all the parts, buy all the tools, fit all the parts, and coat the whole gun for less than $2500. I think the real debate begins at the man hours and quality of the work.
I also agree with Suicide, not everyone is willing to do the work themselves, that is obviously the target market.
ETA: I’m not being very clear, my original question was based on perceived value. What is the perceived value over other similarly priced guns or a custom gun built by an individual?
If you believe that you can do it, then your one of the few. The real question is if your abilities in fit and finish stack up to the 1911 I am making. This is where you get into true cost. The other thing you have to remember, is how much is your time worth? My time is worth a lot. If you added up all the parts, coating cost and your hourly wage (at least 20hrs worth), you would find that this 1911 is a bargain compared to others.
If our 1911’s use some of the best parts known to the 1911 world, has exceptional fit/finish, shoots accurately then it will be viewed as one of the best deals on the 1911 markets today (which is the intention).
Grant, if you’re doing this for ‘the love’ than I can somewhat understand.
If you’re doing this to make money and get rich I don’t see how you’ll make it. Figure out how much time you’ll spend with each customer; before, during and after production then figure out how much money your sweat equity is worth per hour and do the math. Will your time be better spent else where? What is your ROI per 1911? Is there a better ROI available in something else?
This is good in theory but I for one would not pay that kind of money for a unknown product, sorry. Your right, all the parts are good but I don’t want a Caspian frame/slide for one. Two, this mystery guy might be good but we don’t know. There are too many excellent choices in the price range that are proven to risk going with someone new. Les Baer, Wilson, Nighthawk and the list goes on. I wish you well, but to me this is a bad idea.
There is no money in ANY firearm. Money is always in accessories. A dealer has to look at firearms as a platform to sell accessories (lights, lasers, optics, etc).
Your one of the people that has to have a name on a gun for people to be impressed. My 1911’s will NOT be for you.
The product will be fully reviewed for quality and accuracy (there will be no “unkowns” about it). Again, if Caspian is not a good enough frame for you these are not the 1911’s for you. You will also never know the 1911 smiths name (as that is the way he likes it).
From what I have seen and know, threre won’t be ANY comparison in this price range. This gun will compete in quality with guns that are priced in the $3k range.
I understand that. So you think spending all this time and effort on a ‘custom’ 1911 will equate to enough 1911 accessory sales to make it all worth while?
Your definately answering a lot of questions for me. Mystery guy we’ll never know about, questioning my knowledge of 1911 and telling me I need I name on the side??? Your kidding yourself Grant. That gun specs out no different than anything in the market in that price range. Please, tell me I’m wrong and you have somehow found a way to make a better 1911 and a cheaper price.
I missed where anyone questioned your knowledge on 1911’s. Your opinion is simply that (yours) and doesn’t make it any better than anyone elses.
Have you ever seen a complete listing of parts in a 1911 from any manufacturer? If so, please point me to the link where they list everything and where it came from. Truth of the matter, is that companies do NOT list the parts used (as a general rule) because they often times use cheaper parts.
The guns that I have seen in the $2,500 range have VERY little work done to them. Most of them look like they put a bunch of parts together and called it a day. That is not the case with these 1911’s. The body work alone has 15hrs of work done to them. Please call up some other companies and ask them how much labor they put in theirs!