Hey, first post here as well as first build. I was never really into black rifles(more into lever, M1/ M1a type stuff) until a few weeks ago. While at a gun-show a friend mentioned how easy it was to assembly one. Since then I have been reading everything I can about them and checked a few out at local gun stores.
I bought a 1911 at the gun show so funds are kind of low but since I have a new gun to shoot I am in no hurry to get an AR right now and decided to space the build out over the next few months. I want a gun that is an accurate and reliable utility rifle mostly for the range. Do not need any kind of slicked up competition rifle.
Anyway so far all I have is a Noveske N4 lower
I plan to order a G & R Tactical Magpul CTR package and LPK along with Magpul trigger guard and pistol grip. I believe that should take care of the lower. My question is about the trigger. Is the Geissele upgrade trigger overkill for what am intending it for or for a first AR. I do not mind spending the money on it, I figure I might as well do it right. From what I understand it is an G2S/S2S. Also any opinions on receiver plates. Is it worth it to upgrade from the BCM that comes standard?
As for the upper I am pretty sure I will go with a BCM 16" mid-length and BCG and Daniel Defense Omega rails.
Thanks and I would love any opinions on this build.
Well holy shit…that might be the biggest endorsement of GA triggers Ive ever read:D
Pappabear…way to go:p
ETA…to the OP
Some will tout the whole…“learn to shoot a stock trigger first…” line, this makes absolutely no sense to me but I believe you will hear that perhaps in this thread.
Personally I just don’t like gritty, unpredictable, and very heavy breaking single stage triggers. I like the uber reliable, highly predictable, and very crisp breaking GA 2stage triggers.
it depends on the mission you’re looking to go on.
hunting? target? SD/HD? 3G competition?
IMHO, you certainly don’t need a “Hair trigger” if you’re going to use it for SD/HD…a 2-3 lb, or lighter, trigger can create ‘issues’ in those arenas; a rush of adrenaline or stress can cause a, unwanted in the end, trigger pull
there are many good ones available right now and it depends mostly on the application and the $$$$ you are willing to part with.
most modular, AR triggers are not user-adjustable and come in preset poundage; my preference is with USER-adjustable triggers.
visit the websites and research which is best for your application.
IMO a Geissle trigger falls squarely into the realm of “once you’ve tried it, you can never go back” category… a B.A.D.A.S.S. S.T. lever is also in that category, which is why Battle Arms Development conveniently sells them packaged together
As to a receiver end plate, you can’t go wrong with the Noveske Q.D. It’s there if you want it, and unobtrusive when you don’t. Plus it’s a (relatively) cheap part, so why not upgrade?
I thought I wouldn’t care for a Geissele trigger for the price. After winning a gift certificate to a distributor for working a USPSA match I choose the SSA for my BCM 16" with 1-4 optic.
It was quite amazing. Much more predictable. Yes it’s lighter, but the ability to know when it will break is the biggest gain for me for longer shots. For rapid shots it was lighter but not “hair” by any means.
This one was basically free but all my future lowers will have them…and I’ll be happy to pay for them.
Thanks for all the replies. I am almost positive I will get the Geissele. I have a feeling that if I do not I will always wonder about it and just end up buying one down the line. Any thoughts on the rest of the build?
I have an SSA-E in my precision AR and a stock AR trigger in my carbine. I really like the feel of the SSA-E. The break is clean and crisp and as long as it properly greased, the 1st stage is very smooth.
The stock trigger, which I got from PSA, has lots of creep, started off gritty, has a heavy pull and a rolling break. Once I greased the sears, the grittiness went away and the trigger is consistent and predictable.
The stock trigger seems to be faster than the Geisselle. I put the precision lower on my carbine to see if there was a difference in handling with the UBR stock compared to the CTR. When shooting quickly, I had more trouble with the Geiselle not resetting than the stock trigger. However, that could be because I haven’t run the Geiselle fast much. I do feel that while the SSA-E is the right trigger for my precision AR, it’s too light for my carbine
Can’t beat Geissele triggers…The man is an engineering genius…
I have the SSA, The S3G and am going to try an adjustable DMR one next…All great triggers…nothing else compares in performance,function, reliablity and quality…
The standard stock triggers are junk period…IMO…I threw mine in the trash after buying Geissele’s triggers…
The trigger is what makes the gun highly accurate…
I have the SD-C in my rifle and I’ve been very happy with it. I don’t have a lot of AR experience though, so take my opinion for what it’s worth. From what I understand the SD-C is comparable with the SSA, except with the straight trigger bow. The SD-E is likewise comparable with the SSA-E. I really like the feel of the flat trigger.
I am definitely not against aftermarket triggers, or trigger jobs in weapons. Specifically for the AR/M4 platform I have a couple including an SSA in one rifle and a S3G on the way. I have very specific uses for these triggers. I have done some very extensive testing on stock USGI types and the SSA.
1 - I have measured the fastest splits with a USGI and a much more positive reset allows me to have greater consistency at speed.
2 - I see no measurable accuracy increase in a non magnified battle type rifle from 50 yards out to at least 450 yards that I can purely attribute to the trigger.
3 - On a high magnified, sub MOA, precision rifle, I only notice about .1-.15 MOA difference that I may be able to attribute to the trigger types and that would really be nitpicking. Of course shooter skill plays a large factor here and the more proficient the shooter is with fundamentals, the less the trigger type becomes a factor.
I often produce much better shooters, or may teach experienced shooters to become more proficient with their overall fundamentals of marksmanship (not just trigger control) via the use of a heavier pull trigger such as a USGI type. There is no doubt that in a a true precision rifle with magnification out to long distances where ultimate accuracy and precision are key, I want a great trigger. For a battle type rifle, I prefer a USGI type trigger.
I agree. I have 2 SD-E’s and I cant see myself ever returning to GI or for that matter even a curved trigger bow. I think the flat bow is a huge improvement in the feel of a trigger. In the end i guess its all personal preference but I will solely be using SD_E’s in all future rifles be it precision, SBR’s or whatever.
In fact, i had the stock LMT 2 stage in my MWS and i honestly felt it was a good trigger. Heads and shoulders above a GI but i’m so spoiled by the flat bow i had to sell it and get a SD-E.
Love reading the replies in this thread from Steve and Dirtyboy…like those two gentlemen, I was ruined for life the moment I started using SD triggers, specifically the SD-E and SD-C.
I also chuckled when you said above that the LMT 2stager was nice but it immediately was replaced. Such a true statement!
For GP type ARs, I believe the SD-C is the finest trigger made.
For Precision type ARs, I believe the SD-E is the finest trigger made.
We could try and measure the difference in accuracy or milliseconds on a shot timer to try and justify that either the stock G.I. single stage trigger, or the GA 2stage triggers are better than the other…ultimately much of it comes down to the feeling you get when using a GA trigger vs. a Colt stock trigger.
Hate to use the car cliche but its very appropriate here…
A Prius and a 911 will both do the job that they were built to do which is driving from point A to point B, however after you have driven a 911 to point B, it certainly sucks a big one to then drive a Prius back to point A.
I’ll echo the advice and say get a Geiselle if you want one. Personally I’d say stay with around 5 lbs pull weight and don’t get a 2 stage but whatever, it’s your money.
The standard trigger on an AR is particularly bad. Non of my other military rifles have triggers as bad as my standard M4s. Even my Bulgarian AK has a trigger that I like more. Sure, you can get good results with a stock trigger but if you want to buy a reliable aftermarket trigger more power to you. In my experience a Geiselle is every bit as reliable as a standard USGI trigger. If I was allowed to put a Geiselle on my work gun I’d do it tomorrow.
Right on Trident and it’s thanks to you that i’ve gotten to experience the “high”. Then again it’s also thanks to you that my bank account’s drained haha
mkmckinley: Yeah, you know it’s bad when the trigger on an old “battle axe” AK feels more refined and consistent than a more modern “scalpel” type rifle of the AR. I feel the same way about AK vs. AR triggers and i’m not even a fan of AK’s.
All of these recommendations are spot on. All my builds feature Geissele triggers, staked Noveske QD plates and I’m gradually phasing in the B.A.D. selectors.
I will say this, it’s not too difficult to greatly improve a stock GI trigger. If you do a speed cut on the hammer, use the JP Rifles duty trigger springs, hit the engagement surfaces LIGHTLY with some Flitz on a felt bob and use a quality grease during assembly, you’ll wind up with a darn good trigger for under $20 extra.
As someone who considers themselves a rifleman, I simply cannot accept a crappy trigger when there are any number of ways to have a better one. Can I shoot well with a crappy trigger? Sure. Can I do it faster and possibly even better with a good trigger? Absolutely.
