I have been curious about this for a while, perhaps someone can enlighten me as to why the original Stoner designed firing was redesigned… Specifically, the end of the pin that is hit by the hammer changed from a cone shape to a rounded knob shape. Finally, why did H&K decide to utilize the earlier cone shaped design?
The extra height is required to function with the 416’s firing pin safety mechanism. There is no reason to include one in a regular AR carrier and plenty of reason not to. A standard, chromed pin from BCM will get you by just fine. Forever. And dont try any other stupid crap like taking down the extractor pin with the firing pin tip when you get a normal one.
I don’t know the actual idea, but if I had to wager a guess, it had something to do with pricing. Any shape, other than a straight line, will require more machineing time. The older pin design looks a lot like the new one (material wise) but after making the pin, they then milled the cone on the head. The new version looks like they just omitted the cone operation, but left the material there (thicker). I would bet this was part of a package of upgrades done in order to either reduce cost or manufacture time.
This isnt an issue of “oh well, I know it aint broke but perhaps we could extend its functional life by another couple hundred rounds.” Standard firing pins usually outlast their operators, IF they dont they cost a few bucks to replace and they function just perfectly. There is no reason at all to go messing around with it. And this is beyond messing around with it. Not only do I see no benefit to a 416 pin in a carrier without a firing pin block, but it could potentially malfunction or damage itself or other vital weapon components. Just. No.
Please do correct me if I am wrong. It is my understanding that standard AR firing pins, regardless of the exact design and dimensions of the collar/rim, receive a chrome plating. I cannot locate an online copy of a Mil STD to cite. Please let me know if you do.
I agree that if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it, but my impression from his initial statement of there being “plenty of reason not to” was that he had specific reasons it would cause failure, and I wanted to learn more about these potential problems. I see now that wasn’t the case, he just has vague worries about the unknown.
I do see the point with regards to the extra machining step.
I don’t see the point of folks guessing and reiterating “if it ain’t broke don’t fix it” B.S. It’s my fucking rifle, my life does not depend on it, and I want to know from people who have used a cone firing pin what the difference is - end of story. So don’t chime in with the gun will explode if you install this part B.S. because frankly if I break the gun I’ll build another, and will learn something in the process.
BTW, the link I sent is for a “clone” firing pin, not a real H&K 416 firing pin that has to disengage the safety lever added to the BCG. In fact, its the clone 416 firing pin from the now defunct Titan Defense entity. (This is what happened to the parts they made) So, since the cloned Titan 416 upper did not have the firing pin block system, the link I provided is for a firing pin that will work in any AR15 that uses a regular firing pin. I have handled a real 416 firing pin from an upper and it will NOT work in a regular AR as H&K specifically machined a large radius in the shaft of the pin where it transitions to the first “spool” - blocking it from being mixed up with a regular AR15 pin. They also changed a few of the dims around specific to the redesign of their 416 rifle as possible improvements to the original design. The clone 416 firing pin is the exact same dims as a regular pin minus the cone end…
I will ask again, to see if there is any other information that surfaces besides cost savings. I mean why did they design it that way in the first place?
I see your point. I did not understand that you were planning on using a Titan pin instead of at least one with HK dimensions, if not genuine HK. In that case, I expect that it will work just fine. …Just like a normal pin.
I respect your interest in the history of the design and curiosity about the conical ass of the pin. What I cannot understand is why this mere curiosity leads you to want to put one in a gun you own. You can do whatever you like with your money and your property. Just trying to save you some money and possibly trouble, here. You can defend this conical design till your dying day… The point will always remain valid: there is absolutely nothing wrong with a normal pin.
There is no additional difficulty in manufacturing one design or the other, or any “extra step” in machining involved other than a slight modification of the toolpath on the sub-spindle side. These parts would all be done in a CNC swiss screw machine. The difference in cycle time would negligible.
Pax I appreciate the addition response, I should have clarified the part. However, my main objective with this thread is not to find a better wiz-bang firing pin, it is to try and understand why H&K used a cone end pin instead of the knob end like everyone else. Remember they went to the drawing board and evaluated every component of the rifle for their redesign, and they ended up with a cone pin design - which is what was original to the rifle. So, there is our Scooby-Doo mystery I’m looking to solve.
Im now wondering what the heck is wrong with using the fp tip to remove the extractor pin, especially if Im squeezing it tight together
and simply pushing it out with the tip.
You don’t want to risk creating a burr or sharp edge on the FP tip which could result in reducing it’s ability to ignite primers. Now back to our regularly scheduled programming…
Over the years I’ve seen 2 Sailors break the tip of the firing pin while using it as a punch for takedown. Most everyone has probably used it for takedown over the years once or twice. However, it’s simply not the prudent thing to do.
Knockin’ on the Navy, huh:lol: That couldn’t happen with a jarhead or hua, no never! I will add that these “Sailors” are truly what we call ourselves, dirt Sailors. The only ship most of us were ever on was a cruise ship.
