Background: George Fennell (the inventor of FP-10 and later Weapon Shield) has stated that FIREClean is identical to Crisco Vegetable Oil. Going so far as to state that on a spectrometer, they have an identical signature.
I set to prove this either correct, or incorrect.
Same-chemicals have same-specific gravities. In other words, they will mix when introduced to one another. This makes sense, right? You pour honey into more honey, and it all looks the same. You pour new motor-oil into a container of the same new motor oil, and they don’t “layer”, they are indistinguishable. Water into water…water. So on and so forth, provided both chemicals are identical and of the same temperature.
When two liquids don’t mix (like oil and water) and there is a difference in the specific gravity between two substances, they will form layers in order of their specific gravities.
So…I bought some Crisco vegetable oil, and some Fireclean, stored them both at room temperature, and poured them into the same container. Not necessarily conclusive if they mix, but pretty damning of Mr. Fennel’s hypothesis of them being identical if they DON’T mix.
Well, here’s the video. You decide…does this look like more of the same chemical being introduced to itself?
I gave my father a DDM4 V5 for Christmas in 2014. I lubed it with FIREClean, dropped in an ALG trigger, threw a light on it, and boxed it up before giving it to him.
My father, being somewhat of a collector, literally (much to my annoyance, but it IS his…) has never fired that rifle. It has stayed in his safe, in a warehouse, in 50-90% humidity, for nearly 2 years now, swinging from literal freezing to over 100*F temperatures. Yesterday, I asked him if he would remove it from “storage” and pop the BCG out and describe the condition of the lubricant. He did so, and informed me that it was clear, easily spread between a finger and thumb, but slightly “tacky”/thicker than when it likely went on, although it was not “gummy”, and he said he saw no potential for malfunction, only that it was a bit tacky compared to new. He reported no odd colors, smells, or anything else. I have yet to see ANY oil type product which will not get a smudge “tacky” when left on a surface like that for nearly 2 years, if it doesn’t evaporate completely.
Specific gravity can cause stratification, but hydrophobic/hydrophilic will cause no mixing, like oil and water.
2 molecules of different spec. Gravitas can still mix, like alcohol and water, or oil and acetone.
I believe fireclean is a modified plant oil so it’s not really the same. Thats like saying bio diesel is oil. It’s not. I haven’t tested it but if it doesn’t go rancid, it’s not just vegetable oil.
I’d like to know what kind of spectrometer he used, mass spec? 2 molecules can have the same mass and be different.
I understand that specific gravity may not be the sole cause of the “refusal” of FIREClean and Vegetabl oil by Crisco to mix, but it is readily apparent that they are far from the same chemical.
I started using Fireclean a six weeks or so ago, and that’s not enough time to make any statements regarding long-term cleaning/lubrication. It is definitely enough time to observe that this stuff DOES in fact begin to have a “rancid oil” smell after a week or so on a firearm. What’s more, I coated the baffles and the inside of the tube on a freshly-cleaned Element 2 suppressor, and the first time I fired it, the smoke and the smell of rancid burning oil was horrible. Just an $0.02 from a new member with a low post count.
I wouldn’t be the slightest bit surprised if this was true. America has repeatedly shown a tendency to believe anything when it comes to lubrication. All FireClean has to do to boost sales through the roof is get some NASCAR driver to slap a FireClean sticker on the side of their car.
Agreed. I haven’t used fireclean but vegetable oil solidifies and goes rancid very quickly once heated, so I doubt that’s what it is, unless there are some major additives. If anyone wants to claim that and hold any credibility, I’d want some proof more than similar specific gravity and miscibility/solubility.
Based on its characteristics, I would guess that the base oil for Fireclean is Group V polyol esters possibly blended with some Group IV PAOs. No shame in the connection to vegetable oil; many esters can be synthesised from it. Rand CLP for example is synthesised from vegetable oil. Polyol esters are some of the highest performance base oil lubricants you can find today. They are NOT the same as the oil they were synthesised from.
Without a virgin oil analysis (VOA) we cannot objectively say what Fireclean contains. I’d be cautious of paying too much attention to a competitor’s claims. FWIW someone posted a VOA of Weaponshield on a public forum so we have a pretty good idea of what it has (Google it).
As an aside, lubrication is not the voodoo magic that some make it out to be. You start with a set of target requirements, then choose a base oil blend and additive package that gets you there. There really isn’t anything new under the sun that the oil industry doesn’t know about.
Good ole Mobil 1, $7 dollars for a quart that will last until the sun burns out. I’ve never understood why some people switch snake oil every time something new hits the market. $14 for a two ounce bottle? No thanks.
I don’t know, maybe it’s me. But is this whole fireclean thing going the same way that frog lube went a year or so ago?
Hey, this is the greatest thing ever. Even better than the last greatest thing ever. Now it gums or whatever. Is it really just Crisco? Now, it’s not as great as it was last year.
I received a sample of FireClean from somewhere and subsequently I have been using it since the time it was introduced. I was using Slip2000 but I prefer the film and clean up I get with FireClean. Snake oil or not, I will continue to use and recommend the product. I like how easy the carbon fouls wipes off of parts treated with the stuff. I am not saying synthetic motor oil won’t do the same, but I don’t have any experience with it. For me FireClean works and it is what it is.
I recently started doing some testing with Fireclean as well. I also, followed the instructions and didn’t drowned ny weapons in it. Thus far, it seems to be performing as advertised. There is very little clean up necessary and the carbon wipes off.
If someone wants to use Mobile 1, CLP or whatever have at it. When the world ends I will probably use Mobile 1 as well. But, we aren’t there yet.
I was hoping the Fireclean was Veggy oil so it would eaiser to replace when the bottle runs out. A drop on a BCG and it says wet even after lots of suppressed shooting. Appears to work whatever it is.
