What about the other piston company?
TS
A sordid tale of lies, deception, death and gratuitous sex. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=289790
…ok the sex part is a lie and the death thing hasn’t happened yet.
It was a 7.62 bored can == I think South Africans cant make cans…
It worked fine till a baffle weld failed
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Dont worry the LW situation is in hand 
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I have fired several of the LW weapons. I also fired a 10.5 416. The LW system had a lot less felt recoil to me than the 416. I did not get to shoot either weapon for groups so I cannot personally comment on the accuracy of them. The guy that had the 416 made several comments that he was not impressed with the accuracy of the weapon though.
So the question is “Do we need gas piston weapons?” I think the answer is yes, but not for the reasons that manufacturers say. Variety is the spice of life and I like to see as many options available as possible.
One of the claims of why the piston system is better is because that it is cleaner running. As KevinB pointed out, you can run a well maintained AR 500-600 rounds without a problem. Would it be nice to run a weapon 5000-6000 rds with out a hickup? You bet, but not if I have to sacrifice accuracy. I also like my weapons on the lighter side as I tend to hang a bunch of junk off of them. Most of the GP systems I have handled were overly heavy IMHO.
C4
I honestly think it is more a matter of “want” than “need”. I have an 11.5 from POF and it runs like a Swiss watch.It shoots great for a shorty and runs well. It is very CLEAN shooting. That is what I liked about it. I bought it because I had 3 other ARs and thought it would be nice to have something different.
IMHO, the felt recoil is different, more straight back. I have found it to be just as accurate as my Colt Commando. I doubt the pistons will ever be a replacement for the regular AR, but may be an option for the guy whowants something different.
In addition, it might be pointed out that some of these piston-operated designs(such as the LW mentioned by Grant) simply blow the gas and carbon elsewhere, like under the handguards.
Just because it blows it under the handguards, and you don’t see it in the breech, doesn’t mean that the dirt and heat isn’t going somewhere.
It’s going onto the barrel under the handguards, where you might not see it when you look at the bolt/carrier assy., but it is still somewhere, hidden “under the carpet”(er, handguard) in some of these designs.
And heating up the air inside the handguards is not conducive to keeping the barrel cool.
What I always try to point out in many of these conversations is that there are good points and bad points to whatever design decisions a person might make. If the certain “good points” are important enough to you to accept whatever “bad points” are also present, then it is worthwhile for you to go with that design. If not, then it’s not worth it.
Both the Stoner “Direct-gas-impingement” gas system and an overhead piston will operate the gun. Both types of gas systems are available to buy. It depends on what you think is going to give you what you want, in the best way possible, at the price you can pay.
There’s no “free lunch”. You will get some bad with your good, no matter which system you pick, and you need to decide yourself which way to go. Personally I like the Stoner Gas System in the AR15, but I think that for some purposes like LMG use, or really heavy auto firing , there can be a benefit to the piston system on the AR15. And it will also keep some more of the carbon out of the breech too, but require cleaning elsewhere, with more parts complexity involved, and weight, and reciprocating motion above the boreline, harmonic effects on the barrel, more violent carrier operation, carrier tilt, etc. Some designers have done fairly well in mitigating the typical negative effects, and there are some pretty good ones out there. I think they do have their places in the market.
Can you clarify “in hand” a bit ?
I should have a really good read on pistons done sometime before December. Dinger, expect an IM in about 15 min.
The guy that had the 416 made several comments that he was not impressed with the accuracy of the weapon though.
Grant, that’s interesting because of heard BOTH, ie that its VERY accurate, and then on the other hand it suffers from vertical stringing.
Hrm…
One of those companies with such a system is really beginning to piss me off and it’s not LW.
TS
Is there something that I said that disturbed you?
If so, I assure you that wasn’t my intent.
I thought this was a technical discussion, in which these things might be brought up.
Please forgive me if I was in error about that, because I had no idea that technical discussions would elicit anger in anyone.
My apologies if it was me that caused your anger.
I assure you that I have no emotional attachment to the Stoner Gas System, and I recognize its strengths and weaknesses, and feel quite comfortable recognizing them and discussing them too.
The company that I work for has no competing product in the piston system category, and anything that we do plan to make in the future will certainly be subject to many, if not all, of the things that I mentioned above in my previous post. In fact, we’d have to consider all of those factors, and others, in the design, as a matter of course.
You didn’t elicit any anger in/from me. One of the the companies who use a design like the one you described has. If anyone owes an apology, it would be me for having not been clearer in pointing out with whom I am upset. I am awaiting a response from the unnamed company, maybe they can relieve me of my anger, but they haven’t so far…
TS
Thanks TS.
That makes me feel alot better.
Because I’m trying really hard to be as even-handed as I can in my discussions.
I have no intention of irritating anyone here.
Do you find yourself haveing to hold back? I find myself posting a lot less on this forum then of ARF. I try to only post when I have somthing important to say.
Yes, in some cases, I do find myself holding back, or trying to keep myself “reeled in”.
Maybe that’s good.
I hate having to hold back. My situation with this unnamed piston company may be improving. I hope so. I like both systems, for whatever that is worth. My piston gun can be as accurate as my DI gun, or rather is as accurate as my DI gun. I’m not as accurate as either are capable of being. My DI gun has been in the shop and hopefully I’ll get it later today, or in tomorrow.
TS
kevin, great pics… glad you’re on our side.
back on topic…so does it affect accuracy at all???will it run on all the5.56 ammo?
for a civie couch commando like myself, is it just a “cool” factor or is it really a upgrade to the current platform?
meat