College CAN be a great scam...

General General Discussion
1

My wife has been doing her pre req’s to get into the nursing program through a community college.

Not only have they changed the pre req requirements once but twice. So classes she had taken we no longer needed and she needed to take new classes to fulfill the new requirements. This within a 3 year period since she has been taking classes at a rate of 2-3 per semester. So they stretch out 2 years worth of classes into 3 by changing the requirements constantly. Not only that they didn’t accept 2/3rds of the classes she had taken in WA so she had to retake multiple courses.

Then, and only after doing hours of research, did we figure out the ENTIRE first year she took courses here she was supposed to get charged in state rates because I was military at the time, and planned to make TX my home state of residence. Under TX education codes under such circumstances spouses are elligible for in state tuition. I only found this out after they wanted to keep charging her out of state rates even though she had already been going there for a year. So I print out the law/regulations right off the TX gov website, take it in there, and have to argue with them for an hour just to get her next semester at in state rates.

When I asked about getting refunded the difference for the last year we’d been paying out of state rates it was unfathomable to them. We ended up only getting the last semester refunded as they only give refunds for one semester.

Now this semester she has completed all of the current requirements to get into the nursing program, and was just told the spring and fall semesters are all booked up already and it would be spring 2013 before they have open slots. Keep in mind she was told six months ago she would get in the first semester after completing the pre reqs, and because they have a shortage of professors they are limiting the class sizes.

I wish I could operate a business where I could A) over charge people and then refuse to refund them the full amount of the overcharge B) lie to people about the products, services, and time tables of such products and services with zero repercussions, and C) constantly change the ‘rules’ and ‘timetables’ of commerce as to drag customers into money pits constantly dangling a carrot in front of them while never actually delivering the product.

I am wondering, if in the meantime, while she is waiting for a slot to become open, if the requirements will change again and she will have to attend more classes at the last minute.

2

I worked for several years as an adjunct professor for a local college here in Texas.

I quickly lost count of how many times I told my students “This is what you need to write down to pass the test. But if I catch you doing this at my company, I will knee you in the groin. Repeatedly.”

I often referred to the campus as 75 acres surrounded by reality. It was stunning what they taught. I eventually lost my stomach for being a whore, and gave up the second paycheck.

Ah, the things one will do for a down payment on a house. But my children appreciated the move to the burbs.

Good luck with your fight. Be persistant. Get the VA involved. Find out if they have an ombudsman. Don’t forget your state and federal congress critters.

Be a ginourmous pain in the ass. That’s what it takes.

3

work for the GOV and you can do even MORE :slight_smile:

4

Scam or not, its the way it is at every college in the US. I have been effected by what your wife is going through as well, and Im on the east cost.

5

This is why I refuse to give any money to colleges. At the University I did my undergraduate in I had so-called “professors” who refused to answer questions or give their students the time of day. They always referred us to their TAs - none of whom could speak a lick of English (I’m an Immigrant myself and IMHO, anyone who cannot speak conversational English should not be given anything but a Tourist Visa into these United States).

I was the only student in that University’s Recruiting and Retention Council and I used to get into some drag out fights with Deans and Assistant Deans who were on that council. They would not listen when I told them that the reason that students were dropping out at an alarming rate during their first year of school was because the professors do not bother to actually “teach”.

They would always argue that they were not there to teach but do research. I would then ask everyone why this was then called a “University” and why I was paying my tuition for someone to do “research” and not teach?

When I attended Graduate School I had to pay out of state tuition even though I lived in the same state as the University. The reason they were able to do this was because this was an online Cohort program and even though I lived 45-miles from the University campus everyone got charged out of state tuition because it was not a residence class. Explain to me why it costs more to teach an online class versus one that occupies an actual classroom?

6

They are a bunch of $$ sucking scum.
I have a bachelors in finance and management, but I was (in 1999) three semesters away from my MechE Degree. So I go back to see what I would need to finish that out.
After sitting down with and “adviser” I find out that I would need 9 more semesters! Only two of the new classes were engineering core courses, the rest were bullshit. I called BS on that and reminded them I have a degree, I did not need the fuzzy wuzzy courses.
Didn’t matter, if I wanted the paper I would have to take the BS classes again. To add insult to injury some of the higher level engineering courses have the fuzzy wuzzy courses as pre-reqs.
Yes, it was the same university that I was 3 semesters away from graduating from in '99 and they would have been happy for me to take their MBA courses based upon my bachelors degree.

7

You think college is a scam? Try medical school - it’s a $100,000 education shoved up your ass one nickel at a time.

8

Sorry to her about your wife’s travails in getting into a nursing program. Been there, done that. I also experienced a similar situation in graduate school when the university elected to cancel the degree program I was enrolled in halfway through. What I and several others in the same boat discovered was that the university was required to fulfill their obligations to provide the coursework (or accept an equivalent) and grant the degree per the course requirements stipulated in the course catalog for the year in which the student was accepted into the department program and declared their major.

We ended up going to the dean of the department and, eventually, the administration of the university but ultimately prevailed and the university acknowledged that the catalog with degree requirements on the date we had enrolled constituted a “contract” with the student and they were required to perform on that contract (i.e. allow us to complete our coursework and grant us our degrees).

Cold comfort for your wife, I know, as she has yet to be accepted and enrolled into the program. But, for future reference, when she is accepted into a program and declares her major, insist that the department provide a letter documenting her status, her date of enrollment, and the course schedule required for graduation.

As for the scam of college education, check out a recent article in Harper’s magazine investigating for-profit colleges in the United States (e.g. Phoenix, DeVry, Kaplan, etc.) entitled Leveling the Field: What I Learned From For-Profit Education by Christopher R. Beha (http://harpers.org/archive/2011/10/page/0053).

In the last decade, enrollment at for-profit colleges and universities has risen from around 350,000 to almost 2 million students. Phoenix University is the largest and reported revenues of $4.5 billion last year. And the lion’s share of that money is coming from government loans. For-profits account for 1 in 10 college students but collect almost 25% of all Title IX funding-- $4 billion in Pell Grants and $20 billion in government guaranteed loans.

Unfortunately, almost 60% of the students who enroll at for-profit colleges (who nearly all are receiving some form of financial assistance to pay for their education) drop out without a degree within the first year, are still on the hook for their student loans, and default on those loans at about twice the rate as students at public universities.

These for-profit schools aggressively recruit students, set-up the financing and collect the money, provide a mediocre at best product, and fail to graduate the majority of their students. It’s a hustle, predicated on the misguided notion that everybody needs a college degree to get a decent job, with the American taxpayer picking up the tab and, ultimately, getting stiffed with the bill.

9

When I was in school 25 years ago, the school would apply the pre-reqs that were in existence when you started the pre-req program (you did have to register as being in the “pre-req” program IIRC). If they changed the pre-reqs before you were accepted into the actual program, you had to fulfill the ones active when you started.

I was in CS. We had to take 2 semesters of (more honors type versus more practical type) physics, 2 semesters of Calculus, 3 low level CS classes, and maybe one or two others, before we could apply. But that regimen was locked into stone once we registered for the pre-req program.

10

Yep. My wife is currently going for her masters (ARNP) and is danged close to making the decision to go for her DNP. Someone shoot me, please.

11

Sounds like mine. When I enrolled for my B.S., the degree requirements published in the catalog at the time of enrollment were the ones you had to satisfy. Any changes made applied only to new students. This had the added benefit of applying to both declared and undeclared majors/minors. If I had wanted to add another major or minor along the way, the requirements published in the catalog when I first enrolled, not the ones published when I declared the new one.

12

Yeah…about that…

College in general is a hell hole for people who actually want to think. I’m not talking about the pseudo intellectuals who wear Che t-shirts and shit, but the people who actually question what we’re told.

After serving time in the military and Border Patrol, one of the courses I was required to take was a First Year Experience class. “Teaching” me how to manage my time and deal with the stress of college. Blow it out your ass. My GI Bill shouldn’t be paying for the “fuzzy wuzzy” shit. Isn’t there some kind of way to get past all of that bullshit?

H

13

I’m looking into doing some more grad work, and maybe a different undergrad program. For most things I’ve looked at, I also would have to take a “how to go to college” class, as well as a “life skills” class of some sort. And pay for it.