CACHES

Preparation, Preparedness & Prevention Disaster Preparation & Planning
1

Webster’s Definition:

a : a hiding place especially for concealing and preserving provisions or implements b : a secure place of storage

I’ve been thinking about this concept for a while and have some ideas of its usage. I didn’t see much discussion of it here so I’d like to hear some of your ideas and feedback.

I have a few ideas. First, pre staged items to help me get home or leave from the house. I’ve heard that the sealed 5 gallon buckets work well. I thought placing these on a pre planned route (or routes) to and from my house with some inexpensive necessities might be a good idea. Something with very little investment so if it were never used or compromised I wouldn’t be out much.

One other simple idea is friends and family. I have a buddy that lives half way between work and home that wouldn’t have a problem with me leaving a backpack in his garage.

Another idea we’ve been throwing around is having small storage units rented that we could stash items. We actually already have one close to the store that has some “extra” items in it. I had a discussion with an associate that was going to be TDY at school for 6 months and he thought of having a couple storage units along the way home just in case he ever had to get back to his family.

Lastly, we had discussed in a couple other threads about movement and speed, and if a long gun was a factor. I could see the potential to make a hasty cache and come back to it at another time.

So what do you guys think?? Anything here have merit? How would you implement any of the above?? Do you guys have any other suggestions for containers or locations of potential caches? The next obvious question is WHAT to cache. I’ve got some ideas on this too but I’d like to get the ball rolling first.

2

To sum it up in a word, yes.

To save money, and more importantly, my sanity (what’s left), I like to first define the problem, then look for the answer.

Where a cache would be useful, in my mind is for a fall back plan.

The first thought I had is if your BOV has to be abandoned.

If you have to bug out from point A, to point B, in a perfect world, it’d be no big deal. You would have everything you need in your BOV, and away you go. But if some unforeseen event causes you to have to abandon you vehicle and continue on foot, a pre-planned cache or two along the way would be nice to have. Even if it were something as simple as a 5 gal bucket some basic stuff. I would keep it simple as to the content, things like dry socks, food, matches, simple water filter, space blanket, a bit of ammo. A few of these along the route might make a huge difference in your outcome.

But what if you could not get to your bug out supplies? House burns down, gets blown away by a storm, chemical spill, what ever.

Having a cache located at trusted friends and/or relatives would be nice.

This could be a rubbermaid tote or one of those plastic lockable job boxes. I’d take this a little farther than the first cache. I’d add some extra cloths, maybe an old but serviceable pair of boots. Food, ammo, cleaning gear, mags, basically, a scaled down version of what you had planned on bringing anyway.

Currently I am working on this idea. I have put together 50 cal cans that contain a mix of 6 loaded AR mags, 4- 120 rd bandoleers of 5.56mm, and 200 rds of 9mm ammunition. The next step is some kind of tote or box to put a change of cloths, foot wear, a brick of 22lr (only because there is no room in my ammo can for it), knife, and what ever else I can think of. Step three will be to put together some long term storage food.

I plan on keeping the total package as small as possible. I also want at least two of these set up, in locations that are in different directions from my house. The idea being if forced to Bug Out, and the event is between me and one location, there is a fall back location in a different direction.

The hard part of doing this is that you must really trust the people who you are leaving your cache with. Just because someone is related to you, does not automatically mean they can be trusted. To prevent them from confiscating your cache during an emergency, they are going to have their own preps. It would go without saying that the ideal way to set this up would be to have a minimum of three people/families involved, to include you. Each forms part of a triangle. Each is welcome to go to the others home as a BO location.

The rental unit idea, in my mind is just taking the 5 gal bucket cache idea and expanding upon it. If I had to bug out from point A to point B, and the distance was interstate, or measured in hundreds of miles, then this is a great idea. I would look for storage units in smaller towns, on the outskirts. Would hate to count on those supplies only to find the riots have burned the building down.

This is where I might add some camping gear, and some treated gas.

I have been kicking these ideas around for a few years.

If using a storage unit, or the cache with relatives and friends, I have even thought of extra firearms. If going this route, then I would personally use guns I bought from a private source, with no paper trail. I would only do this in case the guns were to be stolen. This is where the trust factor really comes in to play. In the storage unit, you can just stash the guns in something that looks “un-gun like”. The storage unit would look like any other storage unit, full of crap, vs. a cache of supplies.

Side note, I recently rented a storage unit for three months while moving out & separating from the wife. Among other things were over 50 labeled 50 cal. cans of ammo. I put these inside of those card board boxes that copy paper comes in (looks like those “banker boxes”) . I wanted anyone walking by while the door might be open to think it looked like a yard sale at a trailer park. I did not want them to see the labeled ammo cans, and think, “Hmm”.

Sorry if I was rather long winded, but I have been thinking about this since about 2004.

3

Best place for a cache is in the ground. The more people who know about it, the greater the odds that it can become compromised. I would not trust any other friends with a cache. The cashe location needs to be a secure location, away from other people, so you can take time to dig it up if needed.

The IRA liked to use graves and crypts for their cache locations. Easy to get to, and not a lot of people in graveyards at night.

I once did a course at the NATO LRRP school, and part of the training was in cache placement. From what I remember, we dug a hole and lined the bottom with branches. This served to keep the ammo cans a bit dryer. Each can had a nylon rope tied to it. As you dug down, you found the rope at about a foot underground, and pulled the can up with the rope. Total depth was about four feet maybe. You want it deep enough that a vehicle can drive over it and not disturb it. Ammo cans were easy to pull out of the ground, than using one big container.

A cache for a single person should be no larger than a day pack. In fact, putting the cache in a day pack instead of ammo cans is a good idea. Just throw it on your back and go. One common problem is that people make the cache too big, and the supplies end up as a burden to transport.

The cans or the pack needs to be sealed in plastic and buried in sandy soil if possible.

Use a GPS and get a 10 digit grid. Take photos but don’t make them obvious that you are photgraphing your cache. Instead, make it look like it is just a photo of your family hiking in the woods.

Don’t become emotionally attached to your cached items. It is for emergency use. So, don’t stick your favorite Noveske rifle in it. An AK is a great choice for a cached weapon.

4

I’ll teach you guys a trick using azimuths and distances to locate your stash from a known location.

Say your cache is buried in the middle of a small field. On one end of the field is a well house. Elsewhere, in the field, is a fence post. Remember these two landmarks.

For this, you will need a compass and a cloth tape, or merely pace it if you’re confident enough, or don’t have access to a tape.

Bury your cache of supplies. Now, for relocation’s sake, you will want to obtain a compass azimuth from the nearest corner of the well house to your cache. Jabbing a stick in the ground on your cache will make your azimuth more accurate. Next, walk over to the fence post. Obtain your second azimuth, from the fence post, to your cache.

Next up, log your distances from each landmark. You can do this with either the tape or roughly by pacing the distance, each stride being approximately one yard.

At the end, your journal, or log, should look as follows:

From SE Well House Corner, proceed on an azimuth of 115°32’02" a distance of 132.47’.

From broken fence post, encased in concrete, proceed on an azimuth of 204°18’51" a distance of 73.14’.

Though not perfect, this system can help maintain a means to hunt down a cache of items, where no one will know its location other than the person who set the cache, and whose recovery will not require the use of electronic devices.

In a “Get Home Situation” a mile-marker can be an excellent landmark for a cache, if you’re traveling by highway.

5

From experience, I would caution against relying solely on intersection references taken from such objects, especially things like fence posts… there is a very good chance that in 14.6 months, when you need the cache, the reference markers will be gone, or worse, replaced.

6

Or there is a mini-mall built on top of it.

7

I agree that it is a risky option, and one must accept the possibility that the references may be disturbed/destroyed or missing when one returns.

That being said, I’ve seen ties and non-monumented property-corners (lone oak tree) that still can be used for reference that are over half-a-century old.

It’s a give and take. Obviously, if one is going to use references one needs to pick objects with the least likelihood of being disturbed.

This is one of the only solutions I can come up with for locating/pinpointing a small area with no electronic devices, etc.

As Kino has pointed out, there are inherent risks in such a scenario, and one should most certainly use caution and common sense to choose which objects to reference your location to. The more difficult it would be for these objects to be relocated/moved/changed, the better.

8

plant them like a body, grave yards don’t normaly move. when you say good bye aintie may send her on the way with an AK? marked location, I say other thoughts of container PVC pipe with cap glue bottom on RTV other, need to get open, and keep dry with small back pack in side old alice pack with straps. done a few caches as a kid and in military, ammo cans rust.

9

Guys, I’m a newbie to this topic but find it all very interesting. Thanks for the insight and keep the thread alive.

10

I recently stored 500rds (250rds each) of Wolf 5.56 and 9mm inside a “Sealed” heavy thickness PVC tube and buried it 12"inches into the ground at my #1 bug-out location. Each box inside the tube is vac-sealed in heavy plastic wrap in case the tubes seals fail in some way allowing moisture inside. I"ll dig it up in the next year or two and see if anything negative happen to the ammo. I used Wolf because of price and that its 100% reliable in my BushMaster and Glock and that its primers and case necks are lacquered sealed for longer storage life. I didn’t want to bury more then 12"inches because the ground maybe frozen when I decide to dig in up.

Maybe I’LL dig it up on 12-21-2012 because my family will be on a road trip at bug-out location #1 watching the sky :smiley:

11

Caches in plan view have been in my families plan for about three years now. I have a friend who owns a 3300 acre ranch. It’s 22 miles from town,has several year round springs, and lots of ravines.

About three years ago I got permission to store a wrecked family vehicle on the property in a line of other trashed cars that were already on the property. The difference being this one has a HUGE trunk and a red X on the door.

Colemen stove 5 gallons of white fuel, water filter, lots of food, tarps, tent, lots of ammo ".22 and 762x39 are in place. At first pack rats were problematic, we found that moth balls and amonia soaked rags will keep them at bay for several months at a time.

All food items are canned and or powder and are stored in double walled plastic air tight containers. SPAM will keep you alive for a very very long time when your jammed up.

Ive also left 5 older back packs in the cache all were from forestry fire fighters and smallish by design. Given to me when they were surveyed as to old for govt use. " There 20 yrs old yet brand new"

I use them cuz I don’t want anybody being over burdened with excess stuff" weight" to bingo with to RPII. There is enough stuff for a family of 5 to stay hunkered down and out of sight for multiple weeks before they will be forced to move to RPII.

RPII is a 47 mile three day trek across the hills very rough volcanic rock to rock movement, to where my current duty station is. Again travelling at night thru the lower passes, and on obscure lake shores, just inside the tree lines.

Because I’m a Deputy I have to stay and attempt to keep peace and order, caring for those who can’t defend themselve from the wolves.

It is understood in my family that they are on their own until they get to my patrol turf. They each have their own AK a chest pouch with 6 mags plus what’s in the AK. “Well not my grandson”. In fact he’s less then one year old, and is in fact the wild card here.

I simply don’t know the answer to moving with a new baby.

Anyway I can push out from my trailer/office to hook up with them in time. it’s a shitty deal for the family, but how it has to be. When I signed on as a cop it was for the long haul, not just in good times.

We have seen the need for this for awhile, made reasonable plans to move fast, hunker down, gain strength them move on again to my trailer/office which is supplied with sufficiant stores to last all of us at least two months, or longer if rationed properly…

The family also understand not starting fights, yet the ability to finish one with speed and total violence if needed. IE Someone starts something, try to walk away, if it’s obvious that they are intent on taking you or your gear, then fuck them up big time with pure overwellming violence. " No sense trying to reason with a mad dog".

Of note is the fact that we do not rotate food , we belive that changing the food out every other year is a better stradegy. I do go in every few months and re apply copious amounts of moth balls to keep the rats and pack rats out.

So far it’s works better then I thought it would. The rats have eaten the cars interior but not messed with the trunk area. O yea NOBODY except the family know of the junkers location, it’s content,or what their marching plan is. Not even my daughter in law is prevy to that detail.

It is also understood that at RPI that all left items/food/shelter, and extra ammo are to be inventoried and secured properly before transit to RPII. It is possible that they will have to bingo back if it gets ugly. It’s wise to know what you still have to measure the value of moving back.

The will to survive starts and finish’s in our minds. Have a plan have the determination to accomplish the plan and understand that you may have to deviate from the plan at some point. O yea luck also plays a big part in this kind of unfortunate situation.

Dirk

12

Or even better, Bury them in a grave yard, with the markers for refence points. Then you only need to know the names of the dead folks. Very simple, and, if like me, you live in an area with lots of small, scattered, poorly maintained graveyards, you’re good to go. Sorry if this sounds disrespectful or calous of me, but heck, it’s survival. And no, I have not, nor would I do this myself, it is only offered as an option. My Mom wants to be cremated, but if she wanted to be buried, I would definitly bury her Makarov pistol and the X-hundreds of rounds she has with her. Don’t think I’de go diggin’ up my Mom though.

13

The most important thing to remember about a Cache is to Pronounce it like CASH and not Cashay. The E is silent.

14

Sarah Connors did it. :wink:

15

Damn Dirk. You would sell your family so you can still run your “turf”. That sounds like a horrible plan. The sheep made their bed they can sleep in it. I’d never leave my family. There is a very low chance of anyone surviving. 47 miles? in 3 days? rough country, with a little kid? I understand wanting to live up to a persons duties but never at the cost of my family. Is the only reason they are doing this expedition because you wont return to them? Is there at least a significant benefit to going to you other than the fact you wont go to them. Are you staying for the right reasons? You just want to run a town, be a hero? Does all of your family have the tactical training needed and mental capacity for violence? Does the food cashes have baby supplies? Also does your friend know about what you stored on his land? Will he still be a friend when TSHTF? If you make that many trips to your secret cashes are you sure he hasn’t seen you? Thats a lot of visits to / activity at a “secret” cashes. Wont the red X draw more attention to it. How sure are you that your son hasn’t told his wife? What if he chooses not to go on this plan and stays with his family? How many does that leave to complete this, enough to keep secure? And all this because you’re way too into your job. What is the likelihood of you surviving? Especially if you’re getting between the “sheep” and the “wolves”. I never have nor will I ever count on police for my personal safety. Aren’t cops more of a target in this kind of situation? What if they went through all of this for you to not have made it? Then what? Ive never left a mad/mean reply online before, but I honestly was shocked and appalled by your post, it is selfish and unnatural. It actually upset me to a point of needing to say something

16

Offended?. Your offended that my family is prepared to do whatever it takes to make it thru.

Your offended that I intend to stand by my duty post and do what’s right for those who don’t have the skills or the resources to fend for themselves…

Your concerned that I don’t have diapers. That I some how have violated my friends trust.

Your concerned that I would abandoned my family so that others might live.

Cheap OUR TROOPS DO IT EVERY DAY. for we the people. I have every intention of doing my part back here.

FYI the small community that I work in, has a very high percentage of young men and women in the military and deployed over sea’s. There loved ones are here struggling to make ends meet.

Cheap I have every intention of protecting them at any cost. I owe it to them for their contribution. It’s the right thing to do.

Peace.
Dirk Williams

Cowards run, Cowards abandon their post.

17

I know about duty. I spent enough time at Ft Bragg and in Iraq to attest to that. And on the civilian side as a VFF and EMT. Cowards run?.. In all the times we were ambushed, engaged, hit by an IED, I NEVER ran. Going to fight and serve in a war is one thing, leaving your family to fend for themselves in a time of struggle is another. Why put them in any more danger than is needed? You cant take time to go get them? Could they make it on their own until you could find some to cover for you temporarily? Anything but 47 miles of back country. If they already lived were you worked then by all means stay at your post but why make them suffer so you can stay. And its not just diapers… baby food, formula? Is she breast feeding? If so you have extra rations for her. And yeah I’d be pissed if someone planned this on my land and I was not in the loop. What if he see’s them and cant recognize them (winter clothes maybe? covering the face) right away and just see’s armed people on his land. What will his reaction be?

I don’t know your history but have you ever been in an fire fight? ambushed? Had part of a road explode in front of you? Extreme violence is not as macho and bad ass as it sounds. I’ve seen both giving and receiving end and it is something I would go to great lengths to not have my family subjected to. Even if it meant leaving my job or post. If the need arises then yes survive by all means but why increase their chances of having to use it or be subjected to it by others. My wife and I both have CCW and carry daily, I’m no 18 Bravo or Delta operator, but I am confident in my abilities and tactically proficient. My wife is very good with her side arm and knows how to use an AR. My daughters are 2 right now but they will learn how to take care of themselves. Willing and able to do what it takes is a good thing, making it the plan I think isn’t so much. And if I were in Iraq and someone heard that there was civil unrest in their home state or city or county, I’d think nothing less of them if they wanted to return to keep them safe, I’d think it be crazy if they didn’t want to. I guess were we differ is that my family that I love and made and that are my ultimate responsibility will always be my primary duty.

18

Cheap I was not reffering to you when I mentioned cowardly acts. I was thinking of those cowards in New Orleans who ran like little bitch’s.

Your just going to have to trust me when I say this. My friends land is not a problem. I shoot my sniper rifles there or ride my dirt bikes there all the time.

I don’t care to go into my past history I will say this. I have been read my rights by DOJ and the FED’S and handed my weapons over on more then one occassion in the past twenty plus years. We simply did our jobs, in the end that was the documented outcome.

My grand son is over one now and mobile, eats regular food and drinks from a bottle or cup.

My family “wife and kids” are fairly hardy, with annual 50 miler back pack trips into the high country until a few years ago. Both kids ran cross country and spent many many many hours in the woods and are very comfortable with their weapons and things that go bump in the night.

It is most likely that we will have seen the suggested incident coming and the family will already be in my AO. The 1st post is worse case, no cars, no other options but to walk.

Cheap I think you may have under estimated the power of fear and it’s motivation factor. My wife is a public school teacher for the past 25 years, she loves everybody to a point. I would pitty the fool that threatened our children or even worse our only grand child. If required she would simply put a bullet in their mellon and move thru the situation.

Cheap I share our plan, I really wished I would not have for this very reason. I don’t know you or your plan. Even if I did I would not bash it cuz brother Im not wearing your shoes, or seeing life thru your eyes.

Thank you for your time.

Dirk Williams

19

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20

47 miles is a really long hike. If shit hit the fan I’d make like the Donner Party if I had to. Like I said that’s worst case. We are committed to making it to the other side in one piece.

Our gear in the Cache is pretty much our older camp gear Tents, Stoves, 0 degree back pack bags, “smaller packs to keep the weight load down to a manageable weight”. Multi gallons of fuel ETC ETC, It’s still in great shape and totally funtional, just not the latest greatest widget. The long route is also the path least traveled, no slacker would even consider this route.

You do make good points as does everybody else who shared their idea’s. Like I said I’m not here to judge any of you. You do what you need to do and hopefully it will work out.

My sense of duty and honor and commitment to the people I serve is all I have to give. to make a difference for the people is important. To cut and run would kill me I could never look in the mirror again with anything but contempt for myself. I would rather go to my grave trying to make a difference then that.

Brother good luck to you, should we ever meet the first cool on’s on me.

Respectfully,
Dirk Williams

I had an amusing/amazing conversation happen a week ago. A friend of mine, a very strong Christian friend was visiting while I was loading 20 mags. My friend inquired what the mags were for. I laughed and said for the chinese hord or armagedon.

He smiled, and being of faith told me he didn’t have to worry about armogedon he was on the first boat out of here.

David looked at me and asked me if I was also on the first boat out.

I smiled kept loading mags and explained that I wasn’t so sure about being on the first boat out.

That I may have to fight my way to that boat. And for that reason I was going to keep these freshly loaded mgs and the stick they go in handy.