How do you know how much louder it is?
yes please do tell.
On a 14.5" barrel, the FSC556 meters out at 1.5db louder than a standard birdcage. Most people report that the FSC556 is half as loud as anything else out there and I would have to agree.
We have tested it on all lengths of barrels to ensure that we are not “over compensating” and I think you will find the performance on a 20" to be quite impressive.
-Todd
This was taken from TOS when I asked the industry rep about it.
After watching the video’s of it, I can say that it seems to “do-it-all”. Muzzle-flash is very low for a comp, and full-auto at 25 yards an M4 stayed easily on a piece of typing paper size target. Fired one-handed, the video showed NO muzzle-rise–weapon was held straight out from the side of the shooter)I view it as worth the $90 for what I want.
So the maker of it measured it with an impulse sound meter? Very few people have access to those as 30+ year old used setup is still about $2000. A new setup is maybe $40,000 or more.
In my experience it is likely twice as loud as an A2 flash hider. If you send it to me, I will meter it the same day and mail it back within 24 hours of getting it. I will also flash test it for you and show you photos compared to no flash hider and an A2 flash hider.
I will see about it. If I can order it direct from Talon Arms I will probably pass on your offer as I will just have them install it before my rifle ships. If they cannot get it/will not install it, then I will purchase it and have it shipped to me, then ship to you, and then have you ship it back and I will have it locally installed. I am hoping that after waiting 2x as long as I was quoted, Talon Arms will throw in the attatchment of it though, as I do not have a barrel vice. As to the ind. reps claim, I cannot say what device was used to measure the sound, but I will ask.
I actually don’t know what kind of sound meter it was. It belonged to another manufacturer in the area and they were kind enough to let us bring some rifles up for testing. Based on who it is, I would assume it is a very nice one.
No - I will not tell you who it is.
Todd
here is the thread, sorry to link to TOS, but yeah.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=124&t=336700&page=8
ETA: PWS’s stuff is Gemtech compliant, common sense can fill in the rest I think.
If Phil Dater of Gemtech posts "It was my meter. I tested it, and it is 1.5db louder at the shooter, then that is good enough for me. Otherwise, we just have a guy who won’t say what meter it was, and won’t say who tested it. So… I would have to say the odds are not looking good. Probably a 1% chance the number is close to correct. More than 99% of meters out there cannot measure the peak SPL of a gunshot. And it is not a matter of just having a nice meter as someone on my forum bought a new B&K for over $10,000 and then later learned it did not have the correct specs to measure a gunshot so he had to buy another one. I hope you let me test it. I will post the actual results even if my hypothesis is incorrect.
If I cannot have Talon Arms install it, I will order it shipped direct to you and then you can ship it to me after testing and posting the #'s.
The only reason I would rather have Talon Arm’s install it is the fact that I have no barrel vice and it would just be easier if it were already done by the time I got the rifle.
Why do you need a barrel vise? Don’t you just screw it on with a wrench and use a crush washer?
I was planning to use the supplied peel-washer and have been told a barrel-vise helps greatly vs. just grasping it with my hand. Then again, I have never installed a muzzle-device of any kind, so I am just going on suggestions given me.
I realize that silencers and flash suppressors are your focus, but was wondering if you’ve done any testing of muzzle brakes? I know with most states no longer under the AWB umbrella that flash suppressors are enjoyed by many - still, there are many who have only muzzle brakes to add to their rifles, so I was just curious. I have a Troy Medieval Brake inbound for a build that won’t come to fruition for a few more months, if you’re interested I’d gladly send it to you.
I have an an insert to hold the upper in a vise. I only use it when I need to remove a stuck-on muzzle device. I don’t use it to put one on. I just lay the rifle on its side on a chair and sit on it. Putting on that on needs to special tools or skill.
I don’t have instrumentation to test muzzle brakes for recoil and I never wanted to do a half-fast job at it, so I have not tried. I have tested them for sound loudening and flash. The flat surface on them causes the gas to go from supersonic to subsonic speeds in such a short distance, that the temp rapidly rises and the unburned powder ignites into a big flash. I have seen multiple claims of muzzle brakes which has some flash reduction properties, but my tests on camera have – so far – always shown spectacular flash. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence – so now I feel people who make that claim of the seemingly impossible have to prove it.
Well, Talon Arms is ordering and installing it for me, They are charging $100.00 to do everything. The cheapest I have found it is $92.XX online + S&H. That means I will be saving some $$ on shipping and installation, not to mention personal time saved. I will let everyone know how it sounds to me, and regret that I cannot get it to you for proper testing. Here is a video though of their FSC556 fired at night compared to their other comp (which is ONLY a comp). I noticed (before anyone mentions it) that it is breaking dawn when they shoot the FSC556, but imho it is not light enough to matter as you cannot see the shooter in either the ambient light, or by the muzzle-flash (something easily seen with the DNTC comp.).
http://primaryweapons.com/UserFiles/Media/FSC556_web.wmv
Unless they are doing some VERY unethical advertising, I think the video says it all, and I would think that inaccurate depiction would be shooting themselves in the foot.
Unfortunately you cannot properly test flash with a camcorder as they have automatic gain. I use an EOS-5D with manual exposure at ISO 3200.
I don’t know what to make of that video except it makes me want to test it more and also use no muzzle brake and an A2.
Thanks - thought it might be interesting to see. Nice website by the way - gives me inspiration when the time comes to move to a free state…
I run the Miculek on my 16" 308, and it cuts down perceived flash (from the shooters perspective) immensely over the standard A2 on an M4. I know, apples and oranges, but I would expect the same results on 5.56. As the ports exit only horizontally, you see very little of the flash in your optics while the A2 has a very bright flash right in your eyes. Both of these were shot in the middle of a pitch-black night.
As for rise, it does a very good job on the 308, but not as much for recoil as I would like though the difference between it and straight barrel are night and day. It will however make quick enemies of the guys two positions either side of you at the range.
Alright. I gots to know. If it works as a flash hider, even if it is worse than an A2 but almost as good – it will be impressive. So I just ordered one and will test it next to an A2 on an M4.
I can’t wait to see those results
Thanks Mr.Silvers
I have the PWS FSC556 on every AR weapon that isn’t suppressed.
You made an excellent choice. However, I don’t know if the 1.5 dB measurement is correct because it is significantly louder than an A2 and most people can’t tell the difference in 2-3 db, needless to say 1.5 dB. I would take Robert’s offer on sending it to him for a dB test. If you don’t, then I’ll do it. (Robert PM me if he doesn’t).
Edit, nevermind. I see Mr. Moneybags bought himself one.