Does anyone have info to share on some of the current BCG “coatings/finishes” such as this one? http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1353
I know that some of these finishes/coatings are being applied to BCG’s in order to “apparently” help with lubricity, and possibly even to promote less carbon buildup. However, I’ve not personally ever witnessed any such finish that actually helped with carbon buildup.
Anyhow, I’m not looking for a bcg finish/coating that will allow me to somehow magically stop lubing my M4’s, but rather, I’ve always been interested in coatings such as this, which might possibly help with carbon buildup. More specifically, I’d like to find something that might help prevent carbon from building up in the first place.
Does anyone know of such a product, which considerably helps reduce carbon buildup? Maybe something that will allow a simple “wiping down” of the bcg, to remove the carbon fouling after shooting? I’d be all over something like that.
In my experience, regardless of what lube is used, and regardless of how “slick/slippery” the bcg finish/coating is, that damn carbon just still builds up, and builds up fast. I have not found any type of bcg finish/coating that carbon won’t stick to, or at least sticks to LESS.
Anyone know of any different findings, where a slick/slippery bcg finish actually DID help prevent such stubborn carbon buildup???
How about a lube, which helped with carbon buildup? My preferred lube (Slip 2000) states that regular use helps prevent carbon buildup, but I have found this isn’t necessarily true. At least not to any considerable/noticeable extent.
Thanks for any info.
Wow - that’s pricey. A lot of cash to spend on a coating that most would probably say isn’t needed. You could buy 2 top quality BCM’s with change left over for that price.
Also - you can’t tell with 100% certainty with the size of the pic provided, but that stake job looks a little weak - but maybe I am wrong.
I’m a skeptic with many things - and coatings are one thing I am very skeptical about. Regardless of your intended usage, the fact that they claim you’ll never had to lube treated parts “for the life of the weapon” makes me skeptical of anything they claim.
I just think of the chromed pistons on AK’s and the ADC piston upper I tested-even the chromed surfaces of those had carbon build up and can be tuff to remove.
I agree, it’s alot of money to spend. Does it work? I would have to test it to see and if one was sent for that purpose, I would gladly try it.
From the UCT web site:
UCT ARMS, LLC
UCT Arms LLC, a subsidiary of UCT has recently launched FailZero. By eliminating the need for wet lubrication, its patented fifth-generation, high boron content NiB technology offers a “silver bullet” to the performance part challenges faced by modern industry. For more information, and to order FailZero lube-free upgrades, contact UCT Arms LLC or go to http://www.failzero.com/.
“GREASE BAD GUYS, NOT GUNS” - FAILZERO INTRODUCES WORLD’S FIRST GREASELESS UPGRADES FOR TACTICAL FIREARMS.
FailZero, a brand of UCT Arms, LLC, is producing the world’s first lube-free upgrades for AR-15 tactical rifles and 1911 pistols. As seen at the 2009 SHOT Show, these upgrades deliver an “active-weapon advantage” in critical situations by eliminating wet-lubrication component failure and ensuring optimum performance in all conditions.
FailZero upgrade parts use breakthrough EXO Technology: a unique, patented treatment that creates permanent dry lubricity on metal surfaces, eliminating the need for grease or oil for the life of the part.
Extensive testing by UCT, the Department of Defense, and other agencies reveal – and real-world use confirms – that firearms equipped with FailZero upgrades perform dramatically cleaner, wear far longer, and require less maintenance than those with traditional wet-lube parts.
FailZero upgrades are in active use by law enforcement departments, security agencies, in SWAT and military applications, by U.S. troops in battlefield conditions, and by civilian shooting enthusiasts, trainers, gunsmiths and refurbishers nation-wide.
FailZero upgrade kits are currently available for AR-15 rifles and 1911 pistols, with additional products to be announced soon. The AR-15 Basic Kit includes bolt, carrier and hammer. The AR-15 Extreme Duty Kit includes the upper receiver and charging handle in addition to bolt, carrier and hammer. The 1911 Upgrade Kit includes slide, receiver, trigger assembly, hammer and disconnector.
All FailZero parts are mil-spec quality and will properly fit AR/M4 rifles and 1911 pistols made by BushMaster, Springfield Armory, Colt, DPMS, Double Star, Stag, Kimber and others.
Based on successful testing, demonstration and use with military departments, law enforcement agencies and commercial firearms manufacturers, FailZero expects lubrication-free weapons to become the standard for the future.
UCT Arms LLC introduced the firearms industry to EXO Technology at the 2009 SHOT Show, January 15-18, 2009. EXO-treated FailZero tactical weapons upgrades ensure optimum performance by eliminating wet lubrication – and wet-lube failures – from critical firearm parts. The patented EXO process makes metal parts permanently lubricious, giving manufacturers, refurbishers and gunsmiths the ability to make firearms perform dramatically cleaner and longer with less maintenance than their wet-lubed counterparts. Firearms OEMs are rapidly adopting EXO as the treatment of choice for long wear and lubrication-free operation.
But exclusive EXO Technology has applications far beyond the firearms industry.
EXO Technology creates a competitive advantage for all kinds of industries, because treated parts run dramatically longer and more accurately with less maintenance. Further, EXO greatly enhances heat dissipation, so treated products run far cooler than non-treated parts.
The EXO process is permanent, lasting for the entire lifespan of treated parts. A patented, nodular nickel-boron (NiB) surface treatment, EXO nucleates on the surface atoms of metals, becoming part of the metal rather than merely applied to the outside. In addition, the treated surface becomes harder than the substrate itself, eliminating the cost, weight and degradation problems of conventional hardened metals.
The benefits of EXO Technology to manufacturers include:
• Replaces multiple coatings with one process, streamlining manufacturing
• Provides total coverage and may not require final matching
• Lower environmental compliance costs than hard chrome, anodizing and parkerizing
• Not an exotic material or process
• Repeatable, scalable, transferable technology
• Can be applied to steel, aluminum alloys, titanium alloysEXO Technology is featured in firearms, weapons and support systems used by the U.S. military and law enforcement and security agencies; for engine, powertrain, propulsion and wear components in the automotive, aerospace and maritime industries; in industrial pumping, mining and drilling applications; in food processing applications; and in the forestry industry to reduce saw friction and resin sticking, improving blade life and cut quality. EXO Technology is appropriate for virtually any application where reduced friction, extended service life, enhanced performance and lower maintenance are desirable.
I witnessed their completely UCT-coated M16A1 demonstration at the USAMU Parks Range at Fort Benning, GA, as part of the vendors’ displays at the Infantry Conference in September 2004 or 2005. The weapon stopped so often it was embarassing.
My personal observations are that true slick Teflon-Nickel finishes (like ROBAR NP3) work. This stuff didn’t.
They claim military testing says it works. I’d like to see a copy of it and if it’s a MILSPEC.
Just my two cents – your mileage may vary, but I’d ask them to show me the money first.
One story I heard was the problem they had with the gas port in the M16A1’s being restircted from the plating causing issues and that everything worked once they got the rifle apart and figured out what the issue was.
The idea is sound as Nickle Boron is extremely heat resistant. If what they are after is something easy to clean and that the carbon will not stick to as easily then they might have something.
Speaking of which, what is the coating LMT uses on their enhanced bolts? I have one in 6.8 and is is very easy to clean. Granted on the 6.8, I break down the bolt after every trip out and scrub it spotless as my 6.8 gets treated more like a precision rifle, rather than an assault rifle.
I am intrigued by this but the price tag is HARD to swallow.
IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA
TiN and DLC coatings work very well for many things, but based on the design of the DI system you are going to get carbon buildup no matter what.
The only way you are not going to get carbon build up on the bolt is to go to a piston set up.
Personally, I don’t really spend much time cleaning my BCG
If it’s the same UCT boron coating they demo’ed at Benning my guess is it’s a few thousandths thick and very hard. I’m curious to know how the weapon functions without lube. I’d also keep an eye on wear (the bolt group will be much harder than the anodized finish inside the upper).
My guess is carbon fouling and all the yucky/dirty lube will wipe off fairly easily. I’d like to know whether carbon caking sticks to the bolt tail.
Bare minimum military field cleaning protocol is to remove the bolt group from the upper, wipe down and re-lube, then reassemble. This minimizes the chances of losing your firing pin retaining pin, extractor and extractor pin, and bolt cam pin.
After reading this thread I went to the Robar website and read up on NP3 coating. I may send and extra bolt off to get it NP3ed to see how well it does. All of this in my opinion is the make cleaning easier. I spent 20 years scrubbing M16 bolts so I know how to do it very well.
As far as a super increase in reliability goes if ya keep your bolt lubed even in sandy conditions it will run till you get SOOO much sand that the bolt is physically bound up in the upper… which leads to my want for sand cuts in the bearing surfaces on the bolt but that is ANOTHER thread entirely.
IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA
I’ve had noticeably easier cleaning after innards are coated with Mad Dog XF-7 and Weaponshield.
Has anyone been running an NP3’d BCG? Any potential problems? It sounds like a potentially great improvement.
I have a LMT bolt treated with Ion Bond DLC. It is noticeably slicker, and definitely easier to clean than my standard bolt. However, it does not wipe clean - you still have to use elbow grease and a tool to get the tail of the bolt clean. Still, the carbon seems to come off the bolt with considerably less time and effort - it almost flakes off. For $75, I’m pleased and would recommend Ion Bond to anyone looking for a BCG coating.
Does anyone know if the Titanium Nitride coated BCG (like the one that DPMS sells) are any good? Does anyone else make them because I would prefer not to get a
DPMS, but if they work I would to have one (not to mention they look badass).