Battle to the death! CZP10 vs G19g5 vs M&P 2.0 Compact (starts on pg 6)

General Firearms Handguns - Semi Auto
1

Well, I broke down and bought one. I have been looking for a new striker wondergun since my 320 decided to be a piece of crap. I considered a gen 5G19 or waiting for the M&P compact but nah. Initial observations…

  1. Great trigger. Squarely in the Vp9/ppq class of negligent discharge enhancing fancy Glock triggers,

  2. Great feel. I went back and forth between this and a gen 5 G19 at a shop and there is no getting past the fact that th cz has better ergos.

  3. Basically another super Glock.

I took it to the range and shot 150 blazer brass and 50 Wolf. Ran fine. Very easy gun to shoot straight.

A few thoughts on common criticisms…

Slide release. I played with 5. I had zero issues with any of them.

Mag release. As a right handed shooter, no problem. If you were a lefty I think the right side button is stiffer. I am not a devil child so I have no problem. Honestly, it feels almost exactly like my old fnx.

Well, barring early disaster I will do my usual deal and shoot 200-500 rnds through it a week until something gets weird—or I get bored.

2

This should be interesting. Did you consider the FN509 at all?

3

When you get bored, sell it to me, I’ll give you cash and holster for a 92.

4

Vegas,

Nah, I already had a FNX and it was awesome. My guess is the 509 is awesome too,

5

200 rounds blazer brass
50 rounds Wolf
30 Rounds 124 Gold Dot +P
15 Rounds 124 Golden Saber +P
12 Rounds of 147 Grain HST

6

Today’s Tally…

200 rounds blazer brass
50 rounds Wolf
30 Rounds 124 Gold Dot +P
15 Rounds 124 Golden Saber +P
12 Rounds of 147 Grain HST

Untitled by stoiclawyer, on Flickr

Well, I took her out for some Shooting today. No malfunctions but a few lessons…

THE GOOD:

  1. ZERO malfunctions. Not even a hint.
  2. Superb mechanical and practical Accuracy.
  3. Right out of the box I am closing in on some of my fastest Bill drill averages. This gun is blazing fast, which I chalk up to the trigger.

Untitled by stoiclawyer, on Flickr

THE BAD:

The stippling on the back strap is too harsh. I didn’t notice it yesterday during my 200 round test drive, but after 200 more today my hand started getting a bit tender. Yes I am a wus. I put some duct tape on the back strap and problem solved. I don’t think I would bother filing them down, because it only appears after long strings, and really does help your grip. Very “early USP.”

The stiff mag release is stiff. Basically, it doesn’t seem like an issue until you are doing something like a 6/6/6 drill where you are doing a lot of mag changes. My first three were terrible. Maybe an additional .5 seconds (essentially it was like a flubbed change every time). After that, things settled down as I got used to the stiffness and made sure to depress the button with a little more force. By the end my performance was average. It is overblown, but not nothing. Kind of like learning to use the HK paddles when you are used to a standard mag button.

The Quirky:

But there is a weird quirk where the tension on the mag release is absurdly tight when a full 15 round magazine is seated on a closed action. Basically, you will need to apply a slight bit of pressure to the base pad with your support hand to get it to release easily. It doesn’t effect shooting because it ejects fine when the magazine is empty or down by a round. I can’t imagine why you would be one hand dumping a full mag. Still, it is weird.

My theory is the magazines are too short. They tried to stuff 15 rounds in a 13 round mag. The long mag is a 15 round Berretta mag (the foundation of a lot of modern double stack mags, sig, etc), the shortest is a 13 round HK P2000 mag, and the CZ mag is the mag that is barely any longer than the 13 round mag. Obviously, there is a bit more angle to the CZ mag. Also, you can load the HK and Beretta mags without strain. The CZ takes a bit of a shove.
Untitled by stoiclawyer, on Flickr

I know I am not reinventing the wheel here, I am just reporting what I am seeing.

So, in summary, the gun is fast and reliable, but there is a bit of a learning curve.

7

I really appreciate this.

8

Thanks for the update Greg.

I have parted ways with the Glock series of guns but I’d appreciate if anyone could sit a G19 mag beside the P-10/-07 mag.

If you all may remember, the original P-07 mag was 16 rounds (assumedly to have ‘more’ than the 19) and was absurd to even think of loading 16. It was doable with a mag loader and a lot of force. They backed it down to 15 later on. The P-07 and P-10C mags are identical aside from the -10 mags having a cutout for the ambi release (which the newer -07 mags have as well), so I’ve always thought of the 15 rounders as very reasonably loaded.

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Excellent feedback Greg. Well stated. My experience and sentiment with the P10C mimics yours, thus far.

10

The p10c was a bit disappointing for me, I found no reason for it to substitute for my PPQ’s, CZ PO7’s, or VP9’s which, for me, shoot better, and are more accurate (in my hands).

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Everyone complains about the mag release being to stiff with a loaded mag on the closed slide. I think it is a feature. With the ambi buttons you don’t want to bump one and drop a loaded mag while holstered or whatever. With the mag empty, it flies right out like it is suppose to. I haven’t seen the stiff release issue as a real problem. David

12

For me it would be no issue, but for those who frequently may have to perform administrative unloading/reloading frequently it could be a nuisance.

If that’s the biggest fault that can be found though, we have to admit we’re being very nit picky.

13

Good report Greg. After you have it a little longer let us know how you like it compared to the VP9.

14

If the 320 goes bye bye, FN509 and P10c would be the options. I had an FNP a few years back that I sold. Of course I regret it now.

15

New out of the box the mag release and the slide release on my two P10-c pistols were really stiff and hard to use. Once the mag springs took a set after leaving them fully loaded for a couple weeks, both became very easy to use. The triggers will also become even nicer with some use, any and all creep will disapear and the trigger break will also become a little lighter. That is just the way these pistols break in. The only thing I will be changing on mine at some point, are ditching the aluminum sights for some steel ones of my preference and also having the frame’s beavertail area relieved just a little bit more for my thumb comfort. I have also polished the feed ramps on mine. I have heard CZ has already made some small tweeks to a few of its small parts and with their assembly processes on the pistol. The CZ P-10c appears to be overbuilt in a lot of areas, so its durability should be fine for the long haul.

16

I’ve experienced absolutely nothing with my VP9 that needed to be broken in. It works really well right out of the box.

After shooting Glocks for a couple of decades now, the VP9 was shockingly better in many categories. This was something I didn’t entirely expect when I decided to try the VP9, since both are striker fired handguns.

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I had two VP9’s went they first came out, but sold them because the finger grooves crowded and pinched my fingers, didn’t care for the groove in the trigger guard and I came to the realization that I really prefer pistols closer to the G19 size range, other than that it was a fine pistol, just not for me.

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There is no such thing as a handgun that fits everyone perfectly, and you must find what works for you.

I have found my hands to be dead center average sized, both in palm size and finger length. With the interchangeable panels it fits me very well.

One thing about polymer, regardless of the pistol you have you can file down stuff that irritates you, such as finger grooves. It is customization you can do on your own.

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FYI, CZ has modified the pocket on the ambi slide release where the slide release spring is installed so it will not come out by accident anymore. It was not a real common problem but can and does happen on some pistols. I heard if you call CZ they will install the modified part if requested, but I don’t know if you can just order the part yourself.I like the takedown levers size and placement and the forward cocking serrations beter on the CZ than on my M&P. I believe CZ will be introducing the CZ P-10 Sub-compact at SHOT this year. Just like the P-10c is just a little larger than the G19 and the new M&P compact, the sub-compact will be just a little larger than the G26 and the S&W Sub-compact pistols, making it an ideal double stack carry pistol.

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450 Rounds this week. 300 Blazer Brass, 100 Monarch Steel, 50 Tula Steel.

Untitled by stoiclawyer, on Flickr

  1. Zero malfunctions. The gun burned through all this garbage ammo without a hint of drama.

  2. The Trigger is a hint better. A little of the minimal chatter in the take-up has gone away. Basically moving from an A trigger to an A+ trigger.

  3. The magazine button is a bit better, nothing remarkable. I think most of the folks who say that it loosened up after 500 rounds are really just getting used to the button and making sure to hit it with force.

I left the magazines fully loaded all week to see if it would alleviate the issue with a fully loaded magazine being dificult to eject.

Note: I took a class with Larry Vickers years ago where he advised his students to down load their Glock magazines by one round so that they could be easily seated in the gun during a stress reload. Basically, if you follow this advice with the P10 you will never have the issue with trying to eject a full mag. And again, if you decide you need to eject a fully loaded magazine you just apply a bit of pressure to the magazine base and problem solved. Not a big deal at all…and most of it can be chalked up to people thinking what they are used to is “right.” Because people are used to Glocks few people notice how lethargic the mag ejection is on the Glock. I suspect this is because the original gun didn’t even have drop-free mags, and needing to do speed reloads in a gun that holds 17 rounds probably seemed absurd to old man Glock back in 1980. T

  1. I did some comparison shooting with my Glock 17. I basically did Bill Drills and 666 drills with both guns using the Glock 17 holster (which fit the CZ fine for these purposes). I noticed that on the first string of 666 (which has a concealed reload) the Glock was faster. But after that, the CZ was faster on every drill. That isn’t bad considering I have been shooting Glocks for 20+ years at this point. That being said, I think it call all be chalked up to the lighter trigger in the CZ (although the modern ergos certainly don’t hurt.

Untitled by stoiclawyer, on Flickr
5. By the way, I haven’t cleaned the gun. I just dropped a little lube on the rails when I first bought it. I haven’t even taken the slide off. My plan is to complete the late great Todd G’s 2000 round challenge before I clean it.
I am going to order a holster for my Xc1 and some night sights now that I know the gun is going to work.