I’ve been a dedicated 1911 shooter for many years and carry a 5" steel 1911 concealed on a daily basis.
For various reasons, I’m considering the HK45C with LEM trigger as a possible replacement for my EDC weapon. I have one on the way and while I will ultimately draw my own conclusions, I was curious if anyone here has transitioned (or attempted to) from a 1911 to an HK45 or 45C with LEM trigger? If so, what was your experience? Did you ultimately prefer the 1911 or did the HK win you over and make you a convert?
I’ll expand this question to include any HK45/45C with any trigger variant, not just LEM.
Transitioning to LEM from a 1911 will take a little dedication, as the trigger systems are very different. Be prepared for some frustration initially.
Since you have been a dedicated 1911 guy, you should look at the Variant 9 control plate. It disables the de-cocking feature of the control lever. The HK45 then behaves just like a 1911 where the safety only acts as a safety and the trigger will always be in SA unless you drop the hammer manually or had a misfire. The HK45 trigger is pretty decent in SA mode, and this would be the easiest transition from a 1911. I have got Variant 9 HKs and 1911s, and there is really no issues switching between the two other than differing magazine release locations.
First, that is one of the best polymer 45’s made. Second, it will be a big transition from a 1911. So plan on spending a lot of time learning your new trigger.
The HK45 does feel similar to a 1911 though in its grip. I have a full size HK45 and it has been flawless. The trigger is SA mode is joyfull but DA is heavy. It’s also a very accurate gun. I do wish I would have gotten the HK45c over the full size though.
My first carry gun after 1911s was a P2000 .40 S&W with a light LEM.
I liked it a lot. Very fast and accurate. I think some experienced users on here had pointed out that the LEM can make you tend to pull your shots low at times? I seemed to experience that but also went through a period of pulling shots low due to the .40 making me anticipate my shots…
The LEM requires more time / work to master than probably most systems but I cannot help but like it. I am sitting next to my new HK45C with a light LEM and have been shooting it and my light LEM USP 45 a lot lately. My carry guns are PPQs and a (just acquired) P99C AS that blow all other guns away as far as what I can do with them but I am still infatuated with the .45 caliber H&Ks with light LEM triggers. Accurate and reliable as hell!
I will sum it up by saying that even the grip on the HK45C, as nice as it is, seems way too bulky (noticed this on my M&P 45C as well) when
I go back to my little Walthers, and the 9MM gets many more rounds right where I want them in a shorter time so I leave the range feeling that I would be nothing short of stupid to actually carry the HK45C over my Walthers. Awesome as the LEM and HK45s are, they seem like antiquated dinosaurs to me. Yet I still dumped the coin into them and had to have them. Says a lot for the H&K as I have been doing a massive gun downsizing / selling campaign lately and will only keep the absolute best.
Sorry for the rant but my evolution continued well past the 1911 to H&K stage as much as I love them both, they really seem too lacking to me these days. If I had to stick with a .45, the H&Ks are in a league of their own.
I’m in the process of making that transition after much internal debate with myself. Just as a background, I’ve taken Gunsite 150 & 250 classes, a two day Magpul class with Travis Haley and 5 days of mixed pistol and rifle shooting with Larry Vickers ALL with either my Kimber CDP 5" or a Nighthawk Talon II bobtail. Both guns have at least 3000 rounds each. In that time, I’ve broken a poorly staked plunger tube off my Kimber’s frame along with two grip screw bushings. I’ve had the ejector replaced on my Talon II twice (theoritically due to the magazines striking the ejector upon insertion) in addition to their factory rear sight falling off after less than 500 rounds (ironically, my wilson XTac did the same thing).
After all these malfunctions with so little round counts, I first went out and bought a G17 at the LAV’s urging, followed by the HK45 compact. At first, I was going to trade the HK45c back in, but after the gun ban scare, i took it out to my range and gave it another try with the perspective that I can grip the gun or run it like a 1911. It’s a variant 1, so it can be kept cocked and locked like a 1911, but the gun does not point like a 1911 nor does the grip feel like one (it really needs an optional larger backstrap). The biggest challenge is getting used to the grip on the pistol and respecting the way the gun points when pulling up from low ready positionor drawing from a holster. The mass if the slide and height ofnthe slide relative to your grip is a major factor shooting HK or Sig pistols. You can get your hands up higher on a 1911 or a Glock than you can a glock or Sig. This makes shooting and controlling a 1911 or Glock far easier when engaging targets. The HK makes up for it though with its light weight and superior recoil spring system. Still, it’s a different animal, and it will take me awhile to get used to it. I have a Milt Sparks VM-2 and a Raven Concealment holster set on order., so hopefully I’ll be able to practice this spring more.
I think a LEM vs DA/SA HK trigger vs. a 1911 single action trigger isn’t as big of a deal as getting used to the feel of drawing the hk45 from your holster and knowing how to present the pistol appropriately to line your sights quickly on the target. With the 1911, it still feels more natural to me than my Glock 17, but I can do both just as fast now. The trigger pull was less of an issue, and if you install a LEM spring kit tuned for a 5.5-6 lb pull, I doubt it will feel much different than a glock. For my variant 1 trigger, I plan on running it cocked and locked in condition 3, so that like a 1911, I deactivate the thumb safety during the draw, However, i obviously can’t keep my thumb on it like I can with a 1911.
Again, Iwould worry less about the trigger and more about the subtle differences in drawing and presenting the gun on target when comparing a 1911 to the HK 45. The HK’s different slide height, bore vs line of sight axes amd grip design will take a lot to get used to. I think the advantages to this gun are far to great to ignore though given how fragile and maintenance intensive 1911s really are. I plan on keeping my wilson and nighthawk for life, but I sold my Kimber after it was fixed.
Great post by madangler1. I have had several 1911’s dating back over 30 years. For the most part have enjoyed them all. When I switched to both the HK 45 and Hk45c, I left them as the came so I could use them cocked and locked. Both are great guns, and shoot great in single action. To me, the double action is just a rarely used nice option.
Hk45c is a good alternative to a compact 1911 for carry, even the used USPc’s in 45 that you can find for $600 or so. Use the 10rd magazines for range, home, reload. They have been doing 45’s well for a while.
I should add that it would be a good idea to shoot a version of the
HK45(C) that has the thumb safety enough to judge if it is going to cramp your style or not. I found that even the newer and improved thumb safeties on late model H&Ks are not as user friendly as the 1911’s thumb safety, for me. This weighed heavily in my decision to go with the LEM over an ambi, V2 or V10 for me (being a lefty). I felt that the thumb safeties were a bit in the way and I was not gripping the pistol as consistently with them. The 1911’s were very natural for me.
For several years my competition gun was variant of 1911, actually STI 2011 in .40SW. But as same time my carry and IDPA guns were HK P2000SK and HK P30L, both with LEM trigger. Since 2011 law here allows .45 ACP pistols for CCW, so I acquired HK45C (it is unobtanium here in EU - US-only model), that I converted to LEM.
I never had problems with going back and forth between 1911-style platform and HK LEM pistols. Obviously 2.5lb SA competition trigger beats 5-6lb LEM but it was not big issue for me. Important part is that HK uses 1911 grip angle, so there is no problem with muscle memory on draw (unlike going HK-Glock or 1911-Glock). Some shooters might find magazine release style on HK hardest to learn. For me it was not a problem, as I’m lefty and I use my middle finger both on push button or paddle style releases.
I think, that going from 1911 to HK45C (or HK45) can actually be easiest and best route for dedicated 1911 shooter who want to go into reliability and durability or modern polymer pistol. LEM trigger, while has some learning curve is best option for CCW (I use it in competition as well).
Having essentially been down that road some years ago, I have a few thoughts.
While the HK45 is undoubtedly a fantastic pistol, in terms of accuracy, reliability, durability and build quality, it is BIG for daily concealed carry. While the 45C is smaller, my experience is that it is substantially harder to shoot as well as the HK45 because of its smaller grip.
My choice, and I have these pistols, is a P30 in .40 over the 45C. The reason is it holds 13 cartridges versus eight in the standard 45C magazine, and the P30’s full grip, but overall smaller size allows me to shoot it measurably better than the 45C. This is similar to how I shoot a G17/22 better than a G20/21.
Of course, the only reason I carry a P30 in .40 is when around areas with larger animals, and for that I run the Ranger 180 bonded or a 200 grain DT FMJ penetrator load. Otherwise I prefer the P30 in 9mm.
Thanks for all the replies so far, especially MadAngler’s informative post. All of your thoughts and experiences are giving me a clearer picture of what I’m in for as I evaluate the new platform.
Sounds like I will need to spend a lot of time at the range with the HK45C before I will be able to come to any final conclusions. I will continue to carry my 1911 while I am evaluating the HK. So, if I decide it’s not for me there’s no harm and no foul.
One factor that I know will probably influence me is the issue of support gear. I’m heavily invested in 1911 holsters and magazines. A new weapon will mean new holsters, magazines, mag carriers, etc. I expect that I will have to fall in love the HK before I fully commit, as it will mean a financial investment beyond the cost of the weapon itself.
Emotional investment isn’t what you need in a handgun. Buy a good gun and rock it whether it warms your soul or not. I came up on custom 1911s and use a Glock now.
The HK45C route will not be cheap. I recently bought eight extra eight-round mags for about $70.00 a pop from hkparts.net. They had them in stock and their service is excellent.
The thing to really think hard about (and this comes from someone that has a Chuck Rogers Colt and Springfield Pro among my herd of reliable Colts) is that with the H&K, you WILL, without any doubt, be entering a new realm of reliability. Kind of like going from a reciprocating engine to a turbine engine. And you give up no accuracy. You may gain some.
I am still emotionally attached to my very reliable 1911s but the standards are different. For example, I owned four H&Ks when I started carrying them. I ran some harder than others but it boggled my mind that my gunsmith was becoming a stranger. Besides my cleaning and more often, lubing them, none of these guns ever needed so much as a magazine or recoil spring change.
Hell, there have been several occasions when I had three 1911s at the gunsmith’s shop, down for maintenance, all one time.
I am a 1911 guy, but I have a hk pro limited edition FDE 45c on order and I’m planning on that being my carry pistol.Don’t get me wrong I’m attached to my GRP but like said above"that with the H&K, you WILL, without any doubt, be entering a new realm of reliability. Kind of like going from a reciprocating engine to a turbine engine. And you give up no accuracy. You may gain some."This is what i’m going for.As for support gear,I have several 10rd. mags waiting, it comes with 3 @ 8 rd mags,it has nightsights but I have a 10-8 waiting.as for holsters I have a Kramer owb doublle mag carrier and a Landshark iwb all waiting.
What I don’t have is a pile of springs, spare parts and lube.
