The threads on using an AR-15 in 5.56/.223 for home defense got me thinking…what do you guys think about using a 9mm carbine for home defense?
Why would I choose 9mm carbine over 9mm handgun.
I don’t know…more power, more accurate?
ETA: What about a pistol 5.56/.223 AR?
3 great threads about this very idea. Try searching next time.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=81788
All you have to do is look to the CQB realm… the vast majority of teams have gone away from the sub gun to the carbine.
It wouldn’t be a bad choice… but it’s not the optimal choice. CERTAINLY better than a handgun.
Not that I think there’s anything wrong with 9mm anything for defense; conventional wisdom says that if you’re going to have a carbine sized weapon you might as well have carbine ballistics. I agree with that sentiment unless you plan on SBRing it to subgun size, but then you have to contend with the fact that you can get carbine ballistics in a subgun size package these days too.
Thanks for the opinions and thanks for the links.
As with everything, it is situational. There is no “one best” in regards to firearms or ammo, or maker…there is what works well for the individual. Example, if my gf were to use a carbine, it would almost have to be the 9mm, as anything is very unpleasant and uncomfortable to shoot, due to her ears.
Shooting a 9mm inside would be unpleasant to anyone’s ears in a none defensive scenario.
But as Grossman has shown… defensive gunfire often isn’t heard by the shooter at all…
Oh yes, I understand that. The problem for her is, at the range, even with ear plugs and ear muffs, she will not shoot my AR or AK, and 9mm handguns are out of the question as well. She did shoot my Colt 9mm AR OK, so she would be willing to practice with it, and is not intimidated by it. For ccw, we had to settle with a .22 revolver.
The sound may not be consciously perceived, but the pressure waves still have the same potential to permanently damage hearing.
For the millionth time… Grossman provides evidence that contradicts this belief. 
I doubt I’ll feel any better going to my grave knowing I had ZERO hearing loss in the gunfight I lost.
(even if there were permanent hearing damage, it beats the hell out of permant death - I’m being a little overboard here to illustrate the absurdity of the priorities in a life/death situation)
Pretty much sums up my thoughts too.
Didn’t those threads clearly make the case for using the 5.56 round? I thought they did.
Obviously if you had no other options…but in the end you still have a long gun, that fires a 9mm bullet and there are still overpenetration concerns.
I think there may be a little misunderstanding here. The damage will be caused, regardless of whether or not you perceive it at the time or not.
But, in the bigger scheme of things, it would low down on my list of concerns in a SHTF scenario. Walking away without perforations would be more important.
I read thru all those other threads and this is the only one that matters
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=44869
Interesting that DocGKR does not make any argument that the 556 round has better terminal ballistics than modern handgun ammo, but relies on the training and ergo advantage of an AR15 to make his argument.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Traveshamockery View Post
The sound may not be consciously perceived, but the pressure waves still have the same potential to permanently damage hearing.
MarkM wrote:
For the millionth time… Grossman provides evidence that contradicts this belief.
I don’t know who Grossman is but if he thinks that you develop some magical hearing protection when you are in a gunfight, he would have a hard time proving it to me. How did he get evidence? I’m thinking volunteers would be hard to come by.
Your brain can and will adjust to lots of sounds in various ways but it would be a real stretch to think that instant hearing protection is one of those adjustments.
:laugh: yep, that is exactly what I was thinking as well! You may have some change in your perception of the sound due to an adrenaline dump, but that doesn’t mean that your ear drums won’t be impacted by the sound waves in the same way!
As for the carbine argument, I haven’t had a chance to read through those other discussions, but my thinking is that I would much rather have a 9mm carbine for HD with some good hollowpoint ammo than a carbine in .223 FMJ (for example) because there will definitely be a big difference in penetration/over-penetration between the rounds, yet the 9mm HP ammo will be very effective stopping power without as much risk of killing your neighbors, or family in adjacent rooms. Not saying you can’t still have some over-penetration, but the HP ammo will certainly slow down a lot once it impacts/expands from the initial hit.
I think you missed a wink, but yes, physics is a harsh mistress.
My grandfather’s near total hearing loss, my brother’s perforated eardrum, or the angels singing sweetly in my own ears 24 hours a day will stand testament to that.
Regardless this is a behavioral issue, not a ballistics issue.
Evidently.
If you get a chance to read ON COMBAT you’ll see what I’m talking about. His studies on the bodies reaction to combat are too throrough to cover here.
It’s a good book for anyone who wants to be prepared for lethal confrontation. Understanding what the body does is important for surviving a deadly confrontation.