Some folks over on 300 Blk Talk don’t think its capable of Black bear Hunting. So I’m going to link this thread so they can see how these bullets perform at 200 yards. This load is safe in MY RIFLE. If you use the data please start a couple gr lower and work up in yours!
Very nice. I have been loading 125 grain SMK #2121 and Hornady SST. At a friend’s annual end of year shoot, we were shooting ar500 plate at 300 yards. The 300 blk was very dramatic, loud hits, swinging the steel. Very similar to the 308 hits. 556 and others you could only tell hits through a spotting scope. I had the only 300blk in attendance, and everyone was impressed. Even the fools who regurgitated the typical uninformed nonsense I always hear. Non scientific, for sure, but the results were apparent to everyone. Love it.
18 to 18.3 gr. of H110, CCI #41 primers loaded with forster dies on a coax press.
16" barrel?
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Yes 16" unsurpressed! I got into the 300 Blk just to have a .30 Cal AR for hunting. Without the exspense of going the .308 AR10 route. Is it a long range hunting weapon? Nope! But for alot of hunting situations it is just as good as other calibers. Though I remember seeing , hearing of a guy who kill a Cougar at like 400 plus yards with the 300! One shot too! Many deer /hogs/bears will a test to it being effective. If they could talk!
The ability to hit paper at 200 yards does not make a good hunting cartridge. I will guarantee you that your 150 grain load will deliver absolutely zero expansion at 200 yards when fired from a 300 Blackout. Most 150 grain bullets will not expand at 100 yards in that cartridge. You may as well shoot a bear with a 147 grain FMJ. You will get the same inhumane terminal performance. Most copper jacketed lead bullets require 1900-2000 FPS of velocity to deliver ANY expansion. The main problem with 150 grain bullets fired from a 300 Blackout is you are at that velocity at the muzzle. After R.Silvers came over here with his 24/7 300 Blackout propaganda I drank the R.Silvers kool aid. That was almost three years ago. I assembled a 300 Blackout upper and starting cutting down 5.56 cases and reloading my own ammunition. A few months ago I came to the conclusion that the 300 Blackout offered no improvement over the 5.56 carbine for a defensive rifle and it was less than ideal as a hunting cartridge. I have since sold every 300 Blackout related item I owned.
With the exception of the Barnes 110 grain Blacktip bullet virtually every 110-130 grain supersonic loading will behave as an FMJ beyond 125-150 yards. You just can’t overcome the basic properties of lead and copper in a spire point bullet. They simply need more velocity than the 300 Blackout can deliver. The Barnes Blacktip works because it is basically a hollow point pistol bullet with a large polymer tip. The next best performing bullet is the 125 Nosler Ballistic tip however it doesn’t expand or fragment so much as it just sheds it’s jacket. Keep in mind all of my 300 Blackout experience is with a 16 inch barrel. If you are running 12 inches or less the bullet performance will be even lower.
Here are some informal tests I posted over at 300blktalk before I was banned for posting the results of my tests. I guess they considered it ban worthy to announce the King has no clothes.
http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=128&t=88445
http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=141&t=85678&hilit=bullet+torture+test
I’ve had good success hog hunting with all the supers I’ve tried for hogs up to 220# out to 120 yards or so. It might work well a little beyond that, but we don’t really need to shot those distances. For my personally, I wouldn’t hit anything at 200 yards outside of something like a small coyote or other similar sized nuisance animal. Velocity is really working against you at that distance unless you’re running something really hot.
Too abd you didnt try the 125gr SSTs theyre a lot better for longer distances. Those things explode compared to the ones you tested besides the barnes. Didnt you get canned for your incessant bitching about how barnes wasnt producing enough bullets for you?
Do you have any data to share to support that statement. The OP is talking about using the 300 Blackout on Black bear at 200 yards. At that distance the 125 SST will be moving at less than 1700 FPS if fired from a 16 inch barrel. When the 125 SST is moving fast enough it fragments very slightly more than the Nosler 125 BT due it’s thinner jacket. That also equates to less penetration. That is fine for a 150 yard defensive carbine but again way less than ideal for hunting bear. Even the 165 grain SST is known to crater on deer and elk shoulders at .308 Winchester velocities. I think Larry Vicker’s was absolutely correct when he stated the 300 Blackout was a 150 yard cartridge.
Nothing scientific just the size of the exit holes on hogs. Havent shot one at exactly 200yds but a few at 150ish as thats the far side of my feeder. The sst nets a golfball size exit hole on neck shots. Never tried any of the others for hunting as I hadnt been convinced of the other bullets ability given their relatively high expansion threshold for 300blk. I load 150gr SSTs for 308 if need be but I find that my long range 178 amax load does just fine so I havent bothered loading two loads for my 308.
Nightvisionary
Never said I’d shoot a Blacky at 200 yards with the 300Blk! But at stand distances or over hounds! You bet and I would get all the mushrooming I’d need.
I bet that more bullets will be designed to work with the 300 Blackout velocities. I have had good expansion with the black tip out of 8-11.5" barrels to 250 yards. I haven’t tried further personally, but I bet 250 isn’t the limit.
Out of a 9" barrel the blacktips will expand to 300yds easily. I personally don’t have the need to shoot my 300blk that far so I prefer the SSTs but should you need to stretch the 300blk on out the barnes are definitely king. Running the ballistics the blacktips will expand to just shy of 400yds out of my 16" and 320yds with my 9". That’s not bad for an “underpowered” cartridge.
I think the best thing would be a 130-140 gr SP BT. It would give the needed wt and BC for an Excellent game getter! I like the 130 gr HP Speer- very accurate in my 300 and at 150 plus acts just like a SP. But cause it has a low BC (flat base) looses to much steam at 200 plus yards. I have no problem using the 150 gr at 200 plus on deer/antelope. For bear I’d hold it to 125 yards!
What distances are you specifically talking about. What are you basing that assumption on? There is a specific reason why experienced 300 Blackout shooters/hunters stick with 110-125 grain bullets for supersonic hunting.
There is no evidence that I am aware of to support your first sentence. I would not count on more bullets becoming available. As a long time 300 black shooter and reloader I and many others held that pipe dream for several years. The situation has not improved despite repeated unfullfilled promises from Freedom Group representatives who developed and pushed the cartridge. ATK and Wolf have no plans to produce 300 Blackout ammo or suitable bullets. Winchester has no plans to expand beyond it’s single subsonic 220 grain 300 Blk load. That just leaves Freedom Group (Remington/Barnes). Barnes basically runs a part time, single shift, 4 day a week production schedule and Remington hasn’t produced any 115 grain or 125 Accutip ammo in nearly a year. Without Barnes black tip bullets I consider 150 yards to be the absolute limit for reliable 300 blackout expansion.
The problem with that is the 300 Blackout can’t push those bullets fast enough to provide reliable expansion. You cannot get away from the 1900-2000 FPS required to initiate expansion in a jacketed cup and core spire point bullet. That 130 Speer HP bullet you are using is designed for 308 and 30-06 velocities. It has a low BC of .268 which Im certain was calculated from .308 velocities. It’s actual BC will be lower at 300 Blk velocities. Even loaded to high pressure velocities that bullet will drop below it’s minimum expansion velocity at around 100 yards. The hollow point should offer better expansion than the 130 SP but even so it will never be an optimal hunting load/cartridge.
I don’t get it? Are you assuming that you know what’s going on in R&D and production for All ammunition and component suppliers? What makes you think that employees of Barnes do not work full time?
I personally emailed and/or called reps from each of those companies, some several times and posed the question on current and future plans for 300 Blackout ammunition and components. That is what I base my statement on. Their own words. What do you base your statement on that “More bullets will be designed for 300 Blackout velocities”? Who have you spoken with to lead you to believe that is an accurate statement? The companies I mentioned account for at least 90% of the commercial ammunition market in this country. If they are not on board there is no one else.
What makes me think that Barnes employees do not work full time? You are misquoting me. I stated their production line does not run full time. Barnes has missed delivery dates for it’s 110 grain Blacktip and now it’s 120 Blacktip going on three years now. The Barnes production line operates for one shift Monday through Thursday. I found that out when a member at the 300Blktalk forum visited the Barnes factory. It was so unbelieveable I called Barnes and confirmed it was true. Remington is operating 3 shifts. Not Barnes.
Believe it or not, company reps don’t have all the info available in front of them and can disclose it all to the public. You may be able to squeeze a little more from a production manager. Companies like Lehigh Defense and W3PS have introduced new projectiles, I doubt they’d be the only ones.
Monday-Thursday production isn’t abnormal. How would you consider that less than full time?
Not sure where your ATK info came from but:
http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/rifle.aspx?id=1051