I want to preface by saying this: Yesterday I shot a 1911 for my first time ever. I put 8 rounds through a SA MC Operator, and they all made a neat little ragged hole.
I carry a VP9 on duty. As a detentions deputy, unless I am doing transports my VP9 spends most of it’s life in a gun-locker. I am an okay shot with it, and I think it is the greatest polymer wonder-nine ever made (thats why I have two!) With that said, I have never shot like I did with those 8 rounds on that Springfield. Ive seriously mulling over the idea of buying a 1911, possibly for duty use now.
My agency is a little antiquated when it comes to allowed on duty 1911’s. Colt, Ruger, SW, Sig, Para, and Kimber. The only real option I see there is Colt, even though I would have no qualms about going out and buying a Nighthawk or WC today.
I have not handled a Colt Rail Gun, but that seems to be about the best option I have as far as duty pistols are concerned. I don;t want to buy something that is going to need work from a gunsmith in the future, and I hear grumblings that Colt’s sometimes need a once over. Is this true?
Also, is the 1911 antiquated as far as a duty pistol these days? Am I crazy to go from 15 rounds of 9mm with a lightning fast mag release to 8 rounds of .45 in a hundred year old platform? With my only real option being Colt, should I just forego carrying one on duty and buy something else for range time?
I love 1911s, and if you had a mag capacity restriction I would say go for it, but you don’t. When it comes to ammo, more is more.
I sent just over 300 rounds down range last night. I was working on double taps and failure drills with my 1911s, you (someone used to std cap 9mm guns) would be absolutely amazed at how fast that slide is locked back and demanding a fresh reload.
There are pros and cons to every choice. I just retired from law enforcement, and carried a NHC 1911 for my last 6 years…great pistol, been 100% reliable even though it cost an arm and a leg. However, when it comes to capacity in a fight, the 1911 is lacking. If you truly shoot the 1911 better than anything else, I’d say go for it. But a proper built 1911 usually isnt an out of the box gun. And with modern ammo, to be honest a bad guy isnt going to tell the difference between a 9 and a 45.
The 1911 bug attacked me also a few weeks ago. A few months ago I sold my MC Operator (regrettably) after 10 years of duty use to go with the M&P9. My father-in-law and I went to the local gun range and he brought his Springfield RO chambered in .45. I was surprised at the accuracy of what Springfield calls an entry level pistol. But the bug bit the hell out of me and now I’m back to the same situation as LowSpeed. I don’t believe the 1911 is antiquated. I’ve read quite a bit on the 1911 for duty use and can agree with most of what the experts (Yam, Hack, LAV, and the like) say about the 1911 for duty use. I know a lot is said about a department issuing 1911, the maintenance/care it takes and the dedication one must have to maintain the 1911. I do believe the 1911 still has a place for duty use. I once heard, “The M&P, Glock, etc., are good to go for duty use, but if you’re ever in the situation where a critical/accurate shot is needed then the 1911 is what I want in my hands.”
The HKs, M&Ps, Glocks, Sigs, and so on are the most popular duty pistols. They don’t take a whole lot to care and maintenance for the department or individual officer. The 1911, if that officer is committed to the care and maintenance of it and trains with it, is no doubt still suitable for duty use. There’s a reason why it’s been around 100+ years and not going away anytime soon. I’ve shot a Colt Rail Gun and it was very accurate. The quality of the pistol was very good. If you’re choosing from what your department says you can carry, then I would go with Colt. But if it is going to be in the gun locker for most of the time, why spend the money?
Have you thought about a 1911 chambered in 9mm?
The 1911 bug bit me so bad that I ended up getting an infection…
I don’t think its a problem having a 1911 for a duty gun. However what I put on a duty belt is a Nighthawk. I say get a high quality of a 1911 as you can afford and see how it goes. Besides its not like your limited to owning one at a time. If it don’t work out change.
I sold my 1911s a while back; however, the bug has hit again. My problem is there are too many good choices. Even ranking them into price ranges only helps a bit. If only there was one, true, clear cut, best in the under $1,000.00, under $2,000 and under $3,000.00 categories, life would be much simpler!
It may sound silly, but I think the point was that the 1911 is very accurate. I’m not saying that other pistols can’t be accuarte, but how many threads have you seen about poor accuracy with M&P or Glock and having to buy an aftermarket barrel. It is rare to see a thread about a 1911 with poor accuracy. Most quality 1911’s are gtg out of the box.
To me, the 1911 as a duty pistol is not antiquated. It still serves a very useful purpose. It does require the shooter to be more accurate since ammo capacity is limited. I carry a Kimber 1911 for CCW with an 8-round magazine and a spare 8-rounder. Several years ago, I worked part-time as an armed security officer and carried a Glock19 with two spare 15-round magazines. If I had the option to carry a 1911, I would have. I have been fascinated with the 1911 for nearly 30 years. I bought my first one back in 1986. Up until three years ago, I had amassed 81 1911s in my collection. I am now down to only 19. I also once had a MC Operator that I sold to my little brother last year. That is a fantastic pistol. I have a Remington R1 Enhanced that was impressive right out of the box. I also have a 1918 Colt 1911 “Black Army” that is a great shooting pistol as well. One of the smoothest shooting 1911s I have ever owned. If you are actively looking for a 1911, I recommend taking a look at the SIG TacOps model. These are sweet shooting 1911s.
I say this as someone who is switching this year from a Glock to a 1911.
A 1911 is truly an enthusiast’s gun. What I mean by that, is that if you aren’t passionate enough about the platform to learn its nuances and how to either handle at least some of them on your own or be willing to take it to a gun smith, it’s probably best to have a modern wonder 9 for a duty gun and keep the 1911 for fun days at the range.
I’ll tell you what my process is for switching to a 1911 this year as my CCW gun. I picked up a Dan Wesson Valor, because I wanted something with no MIM in the gun, especially in the fire control group and the slide stop. I’m going to spend a few weekends at the range making sure this is the direction I want to go, and if so, I’m going to pick up a second Valor so I have one for carry and one to train with. This isn’t really specific to the 1911 as I did this with Glocks, too. But, it is specifically important to me with a 1911 because there are some things on the gun I’m not capable of fixing myself. If I have an issue like I want a back up while my other gun is off getting fixed.
The 1911 has a lot of strengths. The trigger is stuff of legend, and there is so much history behind the gun that you can get one set up exactly how you want. What are two of the most important parts of pistol shooting? Grip and trigger press, so there are two major pluses in the 1911’s corner. It’s not without it’s short comings, though. Specifically, capacity.
For me, I don’t think this is a huge deal. Ask me in a year if I’ve changed my mind on it. I normally carry a glock 19 and a spare magazine, and I keep all my glock mags downloaded by one, so I’m rolling with 29 rounds. With a 1911 I could carry 2 back up mags and be at 25 (8 round mags with 1 in the chamber). I could be at 29 if I wanted to carry 10 round back up mags. Either way, close enough for me, aside from the fact that if I need to go through all those rounds I have to make 1 more reload than I would with the glock. Because of that, slide lock reloads are going to be something I drill hard this year. I’m also going to try to get into a 1911 specific class that will cover some armorer stuff.
If all that sounds like a giant pain in the ass, there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. But, it does mean that you should probably keep your VP9s for work, and pick up a 1911 as a fun gun.
You should really own 1 in the $1000 range, 1 in the $2000, and 1 in the $3000 range.
All kidding aside, I have had a fascination with the 1911 platform since 2006. My everyday carry is a HK, but I absolutely love a good 1911. Like it was mentioned earlier in the thread, it is just like owning a classic muscle car. It has good looks and great performance when it is firing on all cylinders.
Colt and Springfield are putting out great guns under $1000, Les Baer and Dan Wesson have great guns at $2000, and a Wilson Combat at $3000 is a Cadillac!
If you have the itch and can afford it, scratch it.
I started with a Springfield NM as a work gun in LA and San Jose area. I took the same gun to Gunsite in the 90’s with no issues. I have to use the Glock as a work gun now, but I still love the single action 45’s. I have the S&W scandium 45, Springfiled NM and Operator. For me, I am just more accurate with the 45 at 25 yards plus. Again my use of the 45 has been urban environments. In rural environments I feel more comfortatble with Glock series. I guess the exposure to dirt would be an issue the single action semi autos. That is my opinion.
I went to the range to today and rented a Sig 1911. It shot really well but was dirty and didnt feed well at all. Certainly did not feel like the MC Operator I shot yesterday. I then went to the proshop and handled a Colt XSE. It felt tight and clunky. The controls seemed to be harder to reach than on the Sig and MC Operator. I declined to buy it.
I went to another gunstore and handled a Sig Nightmare or something along those lines. This gunstore had no Colt’s in stock. They said they stopped ordering them as Colt has (according to them) had some issues lately with their 1911’s. The Sig was slick and in my price range, but something tells me I will regret that purchase in the future…so I again walked away.
Right now, I am about a few hours away from buying either an MC Operator (even though I cant use it for duty carry) or a CRG. The CRG I could carry, but my experience with the XSE says that the Colt may not be very refined.
I just bought a second VP9 two weeks ago. My wife is not happy about the prospect of another gun in the same month. I’ll just sell some HSP and Surefire gear to appease the gods…I mean my wife.
Sometimes my wife simply relents and does not oppose a new gun. But, other times, I have to buy her something of comparable value. That really makes each gun purchase expensive!!
Called the LGS, they said we have bi-tone Colts but no Rail Guns. Figured I’d go down and check them out anyways. Well, the “bi-tone Colt” was in fact the Rail Gun lol. Got it for A little under $1100 new, however no NS. Took it to the range immediately. It’s not a refined 1911 like the MC Operator or TRP IMO. It shot well, but I seemed to be shooting it low and to the left. The web of my thumb hurts like hell. Do I need to man up and build a callus or is something awry?
As for your discomfort, some types of ammo are hotter than others. Also, you might try a high grip, with your right thumb riding the thumb safety, if you haven’t already.
