Page 1 of 26 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 259

Thread: Teach me about the FAL

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    9,325
    Feedback Score
    28 (100%)

    Teach me about the FAL

    FAL Gurus-

    I am looking for in-depth knowledge about the FAL.
    I did a search but the three-letter search was less than helpful and the existing FAL Info thread doesn't really contain the knowledge I am looking for.
    If there are existing threads or outside resources/forums I would be happy if a link is provided.

    I am considering purchasing a FAL for personal use and after chiming in on another thread I became very aware of how little I really know about the platform.
    Templar brought up concerns about the shortened gas system, and while I am not at all doubtful about the advised aversion, I would like to really understand the "why" about it. I want to know the little intracasies and details of the platform. I don't intend on this becoming the be all and end all information source, but it would be nice to have a source for that info.

    Thanks.

    ETA- I just registered over at the FAL Files Forums, but if there are other places/people that are outside that community and it's stickies, please let me know.
    Last edited by Failure2Stop; 06-22-09 at 16:35.
    Jack Leuba
    Director of Sales
    Knight's Armament Company
    jleuba@knightarmco.com

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    49
    Feedback Score
    0
    The FAl files is a good place to start. What do you want to know exactly? Try a search using FN FAL, Fabrique National FAL Rifle. I have a few, extremely reliable, 3moa accuracy is the norm. many different makers, profiles. Belgians are most expensive, and very well made. brazilian and Argentines are very nice as well. The israelis are also well amde, amd have wood furniture. And american made DSA's and Springfield Armory SAR 48's, Light barrels are usually Brazilian made,HB israeli's are American made with Israeli part kits. Gas piaton system is clean and reliable, adjustable. The "Short gas system" is this on the shorter barrels?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    6,023
    Feedback Score
    13 (100%)
    Unfortunately, this

    FAL Variant Info Thread

    is all we've really got here. I had a DSA SA58 carbine, and can say that it was a very high quality rifle. I sold it and moved all of my magazines simply because I am not into the .308 game that much. I did go the whole "tac it out" thing and had some limited success. There are a couple of high quality aftermarket accessories, but not many. Templar does indeed know a lot about them - no surprise there.

    Concerning the Mini SA58 FAL OSW, I know that this platform (11" or 13" barrel) does indeed exhibit some functioning issues - not to mention horrendous blast.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    6,533
    Feedback Score
    8 (100%)
    Larry's a big fan of the FAL, as am I. It balances reliablity, accuracy, and ergonomics in a damn good package.

    http://vickerstactical.com/tactical-tips/battle-rifles/

    I personally think that the best barrel length for a FAL is the 17.75" barrel that was found on the original FN Para 50:63.

    I'm not a fan of the short gas system that DSA came up with for their "Tactical" carbines for a couple of reasons.

    #1....I'm not an engineer, but my personal knee jerk reaction is that they're increasing the gas pressure and wear and tear on the whole system putting the gas system closer to the receiver. I might very well be off base here.

    #2...Proprietary parts. That's probably my biggest beef with it. DSA makes damn good stuff, but there are literally tons of parts for the standard length gas system.

    FN had a lot of years to work out the best length for a FAL carbine, and they settled on the 17.75" (18") with the standard gas system.

    DSA makes the best over the counter FAL rifles and carbines available currently in the US, period. If you want the real deal, a FN FAL 50:63 will set you back about $3.5K or more.....while you can get the same basic rifle from DSA for about $2K.

    The DSA rifles use Badger barrels that aren't hard chrome lined. FN would make whatever the end user wanted when they were producing FAL's, some countries did not use chrome lined barrels and they worked fine.

    While having a chromed bore is a good thing for wear and ease of cleaning, they use a quality barrel that will last a long time with semi auto fire.

    The DSA 16.5" barrel carbines work, but I really like the 18" more. You have an adjustable gas system on the FAL, and with the 18" barrel, you can usually set it to bleed more gas and thereby lower the perceived recoil and cut down a bit on the wear and tear.

    There's a ton of info on the FAL, and I'd give a lot of weight to what Vickers is saying.

    I know I'm kind of rambling....beyond the short vs. the standard gas system, throw some more questions out.

    Buck is also a RKI on the FAL system, especially the pre 1989 imported stuff.
    Employee of colonialshooting.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    US
    Posts
    2,709
    Feedback Score
    7 (100%)
    Tagging for interest. This is a system that I have thought of purchasing.
    "Intelligence is not the ability to regurgitate information. It is the ability to make sound decisions on a consistent basis "--me

    "Just remember, when you are talking to the average person, you are talking to a television set"--RDJB

    One Big Ass Mistake America

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    52
    Feedback Score
    0
    For me, the short gas system on a FAL just doesn't make much sense unless you are using a short barrel (which also doesn't make sense to me given the platform). With the 16" barrels the system may shed a tiny amound of weight but it also shortens the sight radius. The trade off just doesn't seem worth it. It doesn't appear to do anything to improve an already proven design.

    The rifle I own is not a factory built DSA but a home build on a DSA receiver. The quality of the parts I purchased from them is excellent and I always received good service from them. If I were in the market for a new FAL, DSA would get my business. Another place to look is Arizona Response Systems, although I think he is pretty booked up these days. He offers a workbook and video on the FAL that is worth checking out even if you're not planning on a home build. The FAL files forum is a great site to learn about the FAL. Sadly, it is not nearly as active as it was a few years ago but it is one of the best sources of info on the FAL.

    Arizona Response Systems
    http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/

    I picked up parts and tools from Gunthings when I assembled my rifle. Good people to deal with. They also offer some books and manuals on the FAL.

    http://www.gunthings.com/

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    9,325
    Feedback Score
    28 (100%)
    Guys, thanks for taking time to drop in on this.

    I read Larry's comments years ago and stuck it into the ol memory banks. I have finally acquired enough ARs/lowers to fulfill my wants and needs and have turned my attention toward something that I have wanted for a while- a quality 7.62 semi-auto. I don't really want to go uber tactical, just something handy, robust, and with the essential accessories (optic, light, sling, and mags). I have considered DSAs offerings, but since I know nothing more than the recommendations of others as far as civilian offerings I am not set in anything.

    I was initially drawn to the models with short barrels, railed covers and HGs, because hey, that's what I am used to with my work guns and is kinda my "default" setting. If the screw-on rail thing works and is able to deal with the real world then I guess that would be a solution, and I can easily attach a bit of rail for mounting a light where I want it.

    If I recall, Larry advocated the 16" gun, but if the 18" run with better recoil characteristics and reduce failure points, well, no-brainer for my use.

    What's up with the DSA A2 type sights? Unnecessary? They seem a bit better protected from knuckle-draggery than the standard type, but unless they are definately more robust, does it even matter? I have been using A2 sights for a long time and I am proficient with them, but I am not really stuck on them if it means more hassle or unnecessary compromise.

    What is the preferred mounting method for optics? Seems like the T-1/H-1 would be fine with the included mount or the M3 (cuz I got one) in the low Aimpoint mount. Does the stock height in relation to the rail make mounting low-powered variables marginal in relation to cheek-weld?

    How do the DSA comps work, particulary the Belgian Short? Is it worth throwing on a PWS or similar comp/FH or marginal return on resources?

    I tend to prefer the feel of a solid stock better than wire side-folder, so I kinda lean toward that. I do have an affinity for M4 type adjustable stocks, but I would rather start out with the "stock" stock before modifying anything.

    What are the problem parts? What would be prudent to have extras of? What kind of life-cycle/replacement schedule do parts have? Will there be any compatability issue with DSA and other metric FAL suppliers? Are there any specific tools that are required for maintenance/repair?

    What simple upgrades improve the system? Mag release upgrade/improvement, grip, furniture, etc? Are they simple things or will they require smithing?

    What's up with mags? Any particularly good or bad ones? Are the 30s more of a hassle than their extra bullets are worth? I see how much larger they are, but do they work? I assume that they are sub-optimal, so I am thinking that I will stick with the 20s and 5s (should I ever feel the need to schwack a deer with it) unless there are good higher cap options.

    What are you doing for sling attachment, specifically a VCAS?

    The two that DSA offer that most pique my interest are the SA58 Spartan and Carbine, 16" or 18". The Spartan is significantly more expensive but the product details are lacking and I really don't know enough past the obvious (sights, grip, NP3, duracoat, +2 mags) to tell the difference or value gap.

    Sorry for the littany of questions, I just realized that asking to be taught everything is pretty silly.

    Thanks all.
    Jack Leuba
    Director of Sales
    Knight's Armament Company
    jleuba@knightarmco.com

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    SE FL
    Posts
    14,147
    Feedback Score
    5 (100%)
    I ran a FAL in competitions against AR and AK shooters for years, and was able to be competitive despite what people told me. I had a ban-era DSA SA58 carbine and loved that gun. Mine came with a muzzle break that would peel paint and knock out teeth, but it worked really well. If buying today I would buy the flash hider model though. I always ran mine with irons too as I never came up with a good way to mount optics at the time (this was around 199-2002 or so).

    If I was buying today strictly for cool guy points, I'd pick up a SA58 TACP Para Tactical. If I was buying today from a practical standpoint I'd get what I had before but with a flash hider, the SA58C FAL Carbine but I'd like to have the A2 rear sight (or whatever they call it). I prefer the 16" but could probably be persuaded that the 18" was somehow better. Nah, no I couldn't.

    IMHO something like the TA33 compact ACOG would be damn perfect on a 16" FAL.

    I never was much of one for researching the history and the like to death, and certainly didn't care about any kind of collecting. I also wasn't really into technical aspects of guns at the time so can't help much there either.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    49
    Feedback Score
    0
    DSA has alot of choices for upgrading. I personally would stay in the 18" range, as far as extra parts. Springs ,Bolt and Bolt parts are all I keep on hand. And never had to change out any parts. There are a few FAL parts dealers that have a good selection od FAL parts. As far as folding stock, not a big fan. Not a good cheek weld on them, prefer the classic fixed.And again, DSA has choices for a number of different stocks. Its a great platform, Mags are cheap, and when I first started piddling with them wasn't much you could do to them, except cut barrel, and maybe penguin furniture. Theyve come a ways since them.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Free State of Nebraska
    Posts
    5,441
    Feedback Score
    7 (100%)
    Some other good brands would be Imbel and IMI Israeli. These were imported as Springfield Inc SAR48s.

    You can also find genuine inch pattern receivers and guns from the 1970s.

    And it goes without saying stay away from anything century or hesse made. But be aware that century did import a number of different FALs back in the day that they did not manufacture that would be ok.

    DCI receivers are cast. DSA and Imbel receivers are forged.

    Just stick with genuine foreign parts or DSA and forget any aftermarket stuff and you can't go wrong.
    "Not every thing on Earth requires an aftermarket upgrade." demigod/markm

Page 1 of 26 12311 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •