Blitz_308's (Justin) Gunfight Tactics, Wounds and Recovery (Graphic Pics included)

[SW-Shooter]

It's a simple fact that having a 1911 could have cost him his life, or it saved his life. You can take it either way. He walked away from it, so his hindsight is what we have.

He had to "get out of the fight" to get his gun back into the fight. He stated it wasn't a malfunction that caused the "malfunction", he couldn't establish a good purchase on the grip safety due to his hands being shot.

I really believe he would have killed the assailant had he not had the "malfunction". I know it wasn't a malfunction, I just don't know what else to call it.

Blitz_308's a stud, no matter what your personal views are. He survived an urban gunfight. It would be cool for a trainer to spend some time with him, what a story to have your students listen to., that would be worth letting him attend the course for free.

[SHIVAN]

It's also entirely possible that the gun was working fine, the grip safety was depressed properly and the brain sent a signal to a busted ass hand that didn't do what it was supposed to...leading the brain to think something "went wrong". No loud noises from his gun...

Ever heard of amputees who claim they can still feel their arm, leg, hand, finger, etc? The brain is a very complex thing, and to be honest looking at how badly his hands were fubar, that the gun was working fine, but his hands weren't working at all...1911 or Glock may not have mattered.

We have to go by Justin's recollection of an instantaneous event that occured amid absolute chaos. Let us not forget that he does not recall being shot in the chest. This is not uncommon in traumatic events, and things could be cloudy in and around the description of the actual traumatic events.

He's a hardcore dude for sure, harder then henpecker lips, but it quite obvious from his injuries that his mindset made him stay in the fight, and the gun was almost irrelevant. He adapted, adjusted, persevered and lived to tell us the tale.

As NCPatrol says, probably a 1:1,000,000 event that both hands were hit in just such a way to allow him to keep hold of a gun at all.

[QuietShootr]

I am surprised at how calm he stayed throughout the whole ordeal. I also found it interesting that the BG fired all of his rounds and would have continued to fire if he had more bullets. The people who carry revolvers because they they think "If I cant handle the situation in six shots, I never will" or "The average number of shots fired in a shooting is 3.6 so I am good with 6" should maybe reconsider their carry choice.

Glad he is alive.

or the "I carry on an empty chamber because I'll have plenty of time to chamber a round if the SHTF" idiots. I particularly enjoy them.

[SW-Shooter]

or the "I carry on an empty chamber because I'll have plenty of time to chamber a round if the SHTF" idiots. I particularly enjoy them.

I laughed a hardy laugh, I love those types too.

[Ed L.]

or the "I carry on an empty chamber because I'll have plenty of time to chamber a round if the SHTF" idiots.

People who believe and advocate that really bug me.

[Cruncher Block]

I very much commend and thank Justin for sharing the honest, sphincter-clenching details of this incident. I hope for a speedy recovery for him,

Reading it, I'm not initially forming any strong opinion about the specific tools. A serious hand injury apparently prevented the 1911 grip safety from disengaging. Use a Glock 19 and maybe the damaged hand would have led to a feeding problem. I don't know. Everything I've read about gunfights and, indeed, everything I've experienced in unarmed confrontations suggests that unpredictable bad stuff has a way of happening when things get to that level.

To me, this incident strongly reinforces a truism about these things: The attacker always has the advantage of deciding if and when the confrontation starts. The attacker has plenty of time to evaluate his opponent, psych up, or simply break off if it doesn't look like the odds favor him.

The "attackee" has none of these advantages. The attackee needs to recognize the situation, accept it, and then somehow go from initial confusion to full-on aggressive counter-attack in a very short time. That's an incredibly difficult task and it's why (IMHO) good tactical trainers preach mindset, OODA, etc. -- it's all about realizing you're in a fight and fighting back.

[QuietShootr]

People who believe and advocate that really bug me.

"But, But, But the Israelis do it, and they have GOD on their side!"

What it tells me, is that they have NO experience with how quickly bad shit happens when it happens.

[QuietShootr]

I laughed a hardy laugh, I love those types too.

There is this tubby asshat on TOS who is a criminal justice professor at some community college in Bacon Ring, Louisiana who I just want to slap in the jowls when he starts with that shit...and he is like a pit bull on a Chihuahua with it - he just CAN'T let it go or admit he is wrong.

IMO, if you aren't comfortable carrying Condition 1, and you can't be trusted not to have an ND carrying Condition 1, you have NO business carrying a weapon in public. Get some training, or something. Jesus.

To the OP - well done on the will to keep fighting. As was already stated, I think the only real improvement would have been to start shooting the instant you were approached with a gun - but I bet he'll be a lot more aggressive next time. Getting caught with your pants down is a life-changing experience if you live through it (trust me, I know.).

[John_Wayne777]

The "attackee" has none of these advantages. The attackee needs to recognize the situation, accept it, and then somehow go from initial confusion to full-on aggressive counter-attack in a very short time. That's an incredibly difficult task and it's why (IMHO) good tactical trainers preach mindset, OODA, etc. -- it's all about realizing you're in a fight and fighting back.

This is a key realization...one that many do not seem to grasp. In the real world we won't be operating under conditions where we are comfortable and in control. We will be reacting to the actions of a hostile aggressor who has most likely tried to catch us by surprise. We will be on the wrong side of the action vs. reaction gap...and we will be held accountable for our actions where the bad guy doesn't give a damn.

These conditions favor the bad guy, which is why training is so vital. Training, situational awareness, and even some basic proactive actions (like lighting the masked dude approaching you up from a distance with the ever-present Surefire you should be carrying) can tilt the odds more in our favor.

[JHC]

Justin's story is a great learning opportunity. Sun Tzu wrote "When the strike of the hawk breaks the body of it's prey . . . it is because of timing." Timing learnings point to openings he may have had where he would have been at greater advantage than where he ended up. The delay until the BG discovered the empty holster was fateful IMO.

As already noted, distance favors the good guy. Is there anything more close to an absolute civilian pistol fight rule?

I don't see any firm learnings about choice of pistol really. The ease of operating the 1911 trigger may have been an advantage as much as a grip safety was a disadvantage. Or as already noted, the wound may have been the whole story as far as running this gun or any. Those sorts of things we will never really know.

I do think it useful to consider his mode of carry. As soon as the BG had the drop on him through marching them inside, the strong side hip carry was not very advantageous. IMO, here was a scenario where appendix carry would have added options to strike from surprise when the BG screened himself from the front of Justin's body. Whereas I find it harder to create settings where hip carry is significantly more discrete to covertly access.

My thanks to Justin for this valuable story.