Considering one of two carbines

[HKGuns]

Not trolling. They were Windham back then. Maybe I should have used the term good instead of very good.

Who is IG?

IraqGuns, the Moderator / Gunsmith who probably would have banned you for posting such nonsense, RIP.

You've been registered since 2012 and should certainly know who he was...........

Search his posts, you'll likely learn something.

[Wake27]

Guys, consider not being giant ****tards. IG was very knowledgeable but could also be kind of a dick. Not knowing who he is really doesn't mean anything at this point, I don't know why some of you seem almost triggered about it. OP sounds like he's watched some vids or maybe learned some stuff a while ago but doesn't have a full grasp. Nothing wrong with that. As to his original question, this forum has pushed Colt at least since I've been here, and while I know that its tiresome to see the same questions asked, the status quo should be challenged every so often. How many of you that are recommending Colts have tried either of his mentioned options ever? How about recently? Can you actually speak with recent experience as to the differences is performance? If its that much of a problem for you, just don't respond. Its not hard.

OP, you're a little off base on several of your posts. Some guys are being a little too much but there is plenty of knowledge around between members in this thread that are still trying to help and plenty to be searched from previous posts.

With all of that said, barrel profile matters to me, I too prefer tapered whether heavy or light. For what you want, the Colt SOCOM is probably great (but more expensive) but I've really only heard good things about both F&N and S&W (for the money). SOLGW may be worth a look now too, their new barrel profile is tapered but I'm not sure how widely that'll be spread around their cheaper platforms. Also, I think you're wrapped a little too tightly around the velocity for barrel length, there's going to be very little difference between 14.5 and 16 so don't rule it out. FWIW, 56gr MEN 5.56 was going transonic out of my suppressed 12.5 at about 650m the last time I really stretched it. To your original question though, while I wouldn't personally choose either, of the two I'd probably choose the S&W only because I have heard from a larger sample size of their owners that seem happy enough. If you can stretch your budget into a Colt, its very unlikely that it'd be a bad thing.

[CrowCommand]

Guys, consider not being giant ****tards. IG was very knowledgeable but could also be kind of a dick. Not knowing who he is really doesn't mean anything at this point, I don't know why some of you seem almost triggered about it. OP sounds like he's watched some vids or maybe learned some stuff a while ago but doesn't have a full grasp. Nothing wrong with that. As to his original question, this forum has pushed Colt at least since I've been here, and while I know that its tiresome to see the same questions asked, the status quo should be challenged every so often. How many of you that are recommending Colts have tried either of his mentioned options ever? How about recently? Can you actually speak with recent experience as to the differences is performance? If its that much of a problem for you, just don't respond. Its not hard.

OP, you're a little off base on several of your posts. Some guys are being a little too much but there is plenty of knowledge around between members in this thread that are still trying to help and plenty to be searched from previous posts.

With all of that said, barrel profile matters to me, I too prefer tapered whether heavy or light. For what you want, the Colt SOCOM is probably great (but more expensive) but I've really only heard good things about both F&N and S&W (for the money). SOLGW may be worth a look now too, their new barrel profile is tapered but I'm not sure how widely that'll be spread around their cheaper platforms. Also, I think you're wrapped a little too tightly around the velocity for barrel length, there's going to be very little difference between 14.5 and 16 so don't rule it out. FWIW, 56gr MEN 5.56 was going transonic out of my suppressed 12.5 at about 650m the last time I really stretched it. To your original question though, while I wouldn't personally choose either, of the two I'd probably choose the S&W only because I have heard from a larger sample size of their owners that seem happy enough. If you can stretch your budget into a Colt, its very unlikely that it'd be a bad thing.

I’m 100% on board with everything said here. Well put, sir.

But honestly, there’s a reason they all say go Colt. It’s because they are fawking reliable and affordable. Cheap ARs have flooded the market and any dumb dude can have one for $500 and throw it in the closet, maybe bang out a couple mags a year.

But if you’re looking for a rig you will shoot weekly, and expect some reliability, Colt is probably the base line.

Sure, there are other brands that would fit that niche, but I went Colt because they’ve been proven over time, and aren’t trying to be the hot new sh!t.

I see them as the Toyota of the AR world. Not that fancy, but runs without issues 95% of the time.

[shadowspirit]

Guys, consider not being giant ****tards. IG was very knowledgeable but could also be kind of a dick. Not knowing who he is really doesn't mean anything at this point, I don't know why some of you seem almost triggered about it. OP sounds like he's watched some vids or maybe learned some stuff a while ago but doesn't have a full grasp. Nothing wrong with that. As to his original question, this forum has pushed Colt at least since I've been here, and while I know that its tiresome to see the same questions asked, the status quo should be challenged every so often. How many of you that are recommending Colts have tried either of his mentioned options ever? How about recently? Can you actually speak with recent experience as to the differences is performance? If its that much of a problem for you, just don't respond. Its not hard.

OP, you're a little off base on several of your posts. Some guys are being a little too much but there is plenty of knowledge around between members in this thread that are still trying to help and plenty to be searched from previous posts.

With all of that said, barrel profile matters to me, I too prefer tapered whether heavy or light. For what you want, the Colt SOCOM is probably great (but more expensive) but I've really only heard good things about both F&N and S&W (for the money). SOLGW may be worth a look now too, their new barrel profile is tapered but I'm not sure how widely that'll be spread around their cheaper platforms. Also, I think you're wrapped a little too tightly around the velocity for barrel length, there's going to be very little difference between 14.5 and 16 so don't rule it out. FWIW, 56gr MEN 5.56 was going transonic out of my suppressed 12.5 at about 650m the last time I really stretched it. To your original question though, while I wouldn't personally choose either, of the two I'd probably choose the S&W only because I have heard from a larger sample size of their owners that seem happy enough. If you can stretch your budget into a Colt, its very unlikely that it'd be a bad thing.

Thank you for the constructive criticism.

I heard good things about SOLGW as well. OTOH, I heard they use Ballistic Advantage barrels which aren't popular in the AR community. I don't recall reading anything specific, though.

That 56gr ammo going transonic around 650m fired from a 12.5" barrel is impressive. I wouldn't have guessed that far.

[Wake27]

Thank you for the constructive criticism.

I heard good things about SOLGW as well. OTOH, I heard they use Ballistic Advantage barrels which aren't popular in the AR community. I don't recall reading anything specific, though.

That 56gr ammo going transonic around 650m fired from a 12.5" barrel is impressive. I wouldn't have guessed that far.

BA tends to be good by most accounts, they're not niche or gucci but many people are very happy with them. Its not worth getting too wrapped up in who produces what IMO, because many of the more respected manufacturers will hold their own tolerances so its not as simple as "they're all produced by XYZ company so they're all the same."

grizzman is right though, the more answers you provide, the more informed other members can make their responses. Many of the more helpful people here will take the time to tailor their recommendations to be of the most benefit, but you do have to answer their questions for that to happen. Otherwise, you might as well just make a poll on social media and get worthless responses full of opinion and no substance.

[Echo40]

I look at threads like this and I cannot help but feel like this forum has stagnated... There was a time when you used to see a lot more variety, with folks who owned all sorts of ARs and were always looking to expand their collections, try out the latest offering by every brand, then post detailed comparison threads between the latest AR and their tried and true AR, which wasn't always a Colt.

I miss when the Colt wasn't the end all, be all, and folks didn't just automatically assume it was the best, but actually continuously compared the latest iterations of Colt Carbines to the latest iterations of Rifles/Carbines of other brands to confirm which was better.

Personally, I feel that there are plenty of viable alternatives to Colt, and I'm skeptical that current production Colts are as good as those produced since Colt lost their Sole Source Military Contract.

Honestly, does anyone hear own either of the options that the OP was asking about? Heck, does anyone here own a Colt produced since 2015? If not, then how do you know what's better? Stats on paper?

Last but not least, for all the generic, fly-by responses about how apparently only Colts can make it through a weekend training course, I've yet to see anyone actually bother to post any proof of it. Where are the pictures of these broken down off-brands? Evidently everyone has a camera on hand to show of pics of them shooting and their targets, yet I've never once seen any pics of the damaged off-brand carbines that are apparently a regular occurrence which send guys running back to their LGS to swap it out for a Colt, so I cannot help but doubt the authenticity of these tales.

If you want to tell me that some kid brought a Bear Creek AR to a weekend training course and had it break down on him, then I can easily accept that, same goes for other bottom-dollar brands, but Smith & Wesson and FN, especially the higher end models? Show, don't tell. Let's see an actual pick of a Performance Center/Tactical/Patrol/etc model with a cracked bolt, ruptured gas tube, split barrel, or some other such form of easily visible damage which assertedly manifested itself because the 4140 barrel steel used has .10% less carbon than 4150.

[HKGuns]

I look at threads like this and I cannot help but feel like this forum has stagnated... There was a time when you used to see a lot more variety, with folks who owned all sorts of ARs and were always looking to expand their collections, try out the latest offering by every brand, then post detailed comparison threads between the latest AR and their tried and true AR, which wasn't always a Colt.

I miss when the Colt wasn't the end all, be all, and folks didn't just automatically assume it was the best, but actually continuously compared the latest iterations of Colt Carbines to the latest iterations of Rifles/Carbines of other brands to confirm which was better.

Personally, I feel that there are plenty of viable alternatives to Colt, and I'm skeptical that current production Colts are as good as those produced since Colt lost their Sole Source Military Contract.

Honestly, does anyone hear own either of the options that the OP was asking about? Heck, does anyone here own a Colt produced since 2015? If not, then how do you know what's better? Stats on paper?

Last but not least, for all the generic, fly-by responses about how apparently only Colts can make it through a weekend training course, I've yet to see anyone actually bother to post any proof of it. Where are the pictures of these broken down off-brands? Evidently everyone has a camera on hand to show of pics of them shooting and their targets, yet I've never once seen any pics of the damaged off-brand carbines that are apparently a regular occurrence which send guys running back to their LGS to swap it out for a Colt, so I cannot help but doubt the authenticity of these tales.

If you want to tell me that some kid brought a Bear Creek AR to a weekend training course and had it break down on him, then I can easily accept that, same goes for other bottom-dollar brands, but Smith & Wesson and FN, especially the higher end models? Show, don't tell. Let's see an actual pick of a Performance Center/Tactical/Patrol/etc model with a cracked bolt, ruptured gas tube, split barrel, or some other such form of easily visible damage which assertedly manifested itself because the 4140 barrel steel used has .10% less carbon than 4150.

You've been here for less than a month and somehow you know the forum has stagnated? Give me a break.

Yes, there are viable alternatives to Colt, I own many examples.

But that really isn't the point of this thread. Sure, he can spend a lot more money for a lot more rifle, that wasn't his question. The point was to try to get him something demonstrably better than the choices he initially posted. After that post it literally went off the rails because he doesn't have a firm grasp on what he wants.

BTW: The forum has far less traffic than it used to, so in that aspect it has stagnated. However, the advice you get here is still leaps and bounds better than other forums.

[Wake27]

You've been here for less than a month and somehow you know the forum has stagnated? Give me a break.

Yes, there are viable alternatives to Colt, I own many examples.

But that really isn't the point of this thread. Sure, he can spend a lot more money for a lot more rifle, that wasn't his question. The point was to try to get him something demonstrably better than the choices he initially posted. After that post it literally went off the rails because he doesn't have a firm grasp on what he wants.

BTW: The forum has far less traffic than it used to, so in that aspect it has stagnated. However, the advice you get here is still leaps and bounds better than other forums.

Demonstrably is subjective until proven otherwise.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[shadowspirit]

...Personally, I feel that there are plenty of viable alternatives to Colt, and I'm skeptical that current production Colts are as good as those produced since Colt lost their Sole Source Military Contract...

I know a number of people feel the current Colts aren't as good as ones made in the past. No one has produced any evidence that is so, other than mentioning more of their components are out-sourced. I guess it is just a matter waiting a few years to hear what the owners of the latest ones have to say. That is assuming the various forums online don't delete the owner's posts.

[Screwball]

Honestly, does anyone hear own either of the options that the OP was asking about? Heck, does anyone here own a Colt produced since 2015? If not, then how do you know what's better? Stats on paper?

My first Colt was a 6920 made in the 2020 timeframe. Marked just “Carbine.” It was identical to function/accuracy to the 2013 6920 I picked up from AIM… which was a NJ L/E surplus rifle.

Only sold the 2020 gun because I really didn’t need both, and liked the 2013 gun better. Went to a coworker’s son with my Springfield Echelon. Money from that went towards my P7M8.

From what the OP put out… I have direct experience with Spikes. Probably not appropriate to use the middle finger emoji… but that’s about how I view them.

I have two of their uppers; .22 and a piston 5.56mm. Probably $1,800 worth of uppers. The .22 has been made into a dedicated rifle, which has a CMMG bolt and M&P magazine fed lower.

The upper had an Adams Arms barrel, which shot awesome. After leaving NJ, I had ADCO remove any pinned muzzle devices. Putting the new one on (Griffin), the barrel rotated in the extension. Spikes has a lifetime warranty, so reach out. Give info to their CS guy, to include pictures. Answered what they asked, then silence.

At a whim, I reached out to Adams Arms. Absolutely awesome people, who offered to look at it to see if it would be covered. Guy I spoke to knew they offered those barrels (1:8” stainless), but was before he joined the company. I got an installed replacement barrel like a week and a half later.

After that, I posted in a thread on TOS and gave the story from start to finish. The CS guy emailed me after, saying they had reports of those barrels spinning in the extension and he didn’t reply to me due to being sick with COVID. Zero craps to give… they’ll never get a $0.01 of my money again.