|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Senior Member
People don't understand CS spring are pointless in a firearm. CS springs are no better than music wire, unless the environment is above 350° F. They are great for valve springs in engines because the internal temperature can be that high and since they live in a oil bath corrosion is not an issue.
Music wire and CS are better than stainless steel for life, but the benefits of corrosion resistance far outweigh that.
Site Sponsor
I think the main reason people like the Sprinco action springs is because they are customizable with all the different size gas ports that are out there in the commercial market.Originally Posted by lysander
Not sure why Sprinco chose CS over stainless steel unless it was just the long life benefits.
You won't outvote the corruption.
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Member
Like this?
Member
Aren't CS springs much better for life(number of compression/decompression cycles) than stainless and music wire? As for corrosion resistance, just spray/wipe some oil or other lube/protectant on it once in a while.
Senior Member
1) No, they are not. Unless you are comparing them in a high temperature environment, chrome-silicon spring are no different than music wire, and only marginally better than 17-7 stainless*.
2) The driver here seems that everybody wants to to have the longest lasting spring. The stress on a spring is highest on the surface of the spring wire. So, any cracks, flaws or other damage to the surface of the wire will be the initiation point for fatigue cracking. Chrome-silicon spring are not very corrosion resistant, so any small corrosion spot will start a fatigue crack.
The longest lasting spring would be a stainless steel spring. In a test of 20 Carbines and 3/4 of a million rounds, not one action spring failed.
Now, if you want to play with spring rates, and pre-loads, and C-S is the only offering available, that's fine, they will work just as well as anything else and last a long time if you take care of them. They might even be better because you can get the spring rate you want, but don't try and convince everyone they are better springs because they are C-S. They aren't.
_________________________
* Careful, there are two popular types of stainless steel for springs, 17-7 and 302/304. The 300 series stainless steels work harden only and not nearly as good as 17-7 stainless.
Last edited by lysander; 03-26-24 at 13:44.
Member
Was about to post exactly this. My entire use case for using Sprinco is that they are a known quantity when trying to tune a rifle to run suppressed. I keep a selection of them in sealed bags with a light coating of oil on them for just this purpose. And, when it comes to running an A5 setup, the Sprinco green seems to be the baseline when talking set ups.
Site Sponsor
Marketing. Also, my understanding is that of the same wire diameter, length, coils, etc, it produces a ~10% stiffer spring. Which is also marketing-friendly. Aftermarket stiffer springs also can cause properly designed rifles to have stoppages.
RLTW
“What’s New” button, but without GD: https://www.m4carbine.net/search.php...new&exclude=60 , courtesy of ST911.
Disclosure: I am affiliated PRN with a tactical training center, but I speak only for myself. I have no idea what we sell, other than CLP and training. I receive no income from sale of hard goods.
Senior Member
The other place than CS is better than if the wire diameter is over 0.080", interestingly, the diameter of the action spring is 0.072", right at the crossover point.
If you make three action springs, one from 17-7 stainless, one from music wire, and one from chrome-silicon, here is what you get: (note, my spring calculator won't even bother to design a CS spring smaller than 0.080", so all have a wire diameter of 0.080")
OD: 0.995"
Wire Dia - .080"
Free length - 10.70"
Total coils - 38
Active coils - 36
Ends - closed
Material . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Music Wire . . . . . . . . . . . . Chrome-Silicon . . . . . . . . . . . 17-7 Stainless
Rate . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.134 lb/in . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.134 lb/in . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.038lb/in
Maximum Load . . . . . . . . . . . . 16.174 lb(f) . . . . . . . . . . . . . .16.174 lb(f) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 15.447 lb(f)
Max Shear Stress . . . . . . . . . 133,480 psi . . . . . . . . . . . . . 133,950 psi . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 120,790 psi
If all we were worried about were the "springy qualities" of these, there is no clear winner, none of these are appreciably "better" than the others. However, if you throw in corrosion resistance, they rank (1) Stainless, (2) Music Wire, and a distance third (3) Chrome-Silicon. Yes, the stainless has a lower maximum shear allowable, but as soon as you get a corrosion pit in the others, that number will drop like a rock.
Site Sponsor
Is there was a milspec stainless steel variety of reduced power and extra power springs available like Sprinco has folks would probably drop CS like a rock.
The main attraction isn’t CS. It’s having the reduced & extra power options because of all the variation in commercial gas ports and because people just like to tweak things.
You won't outvote the corruption.
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Senior Member
It is not mystical material properties that allows you to vary the spring properties. All you have to do is change the wire diameter, the number of coils, and/or the total length. You could also change the OD, but then you start having to major changes to the design.
Posting Permissions
Bookmarks