Golden Tiger 7.62x39 124gr FMJ

[Dr_Thanatos]

That is an important point Dr. Roberts, and sadly, one I don't often have access to. Many of the 7.62x39 bullets in the absence of striking substantial bone exit the body and the projectile is not recovered. Thus determining the actual type of projectile is impossible. The projectiles that are recovered have usually struck intermediate targets or larger bony structures (Spine, pelvis, long bones) and are significantly deformed. As such they can be difficult to identify.

The plural of anecdote is not data, and what I have are just personal observations of multiple GSW made by 7.62x39. However the cases I have seen/performed show substantial injury potential from the 7.62x39 with large temporary expansion cavities and significantly more wounding potential than standard 9mm handgun ammo. I don't know where our shooters are buying their ammo, but I'm guessing it's whatever Walmart sells cheap, just like most other GSWs we see. Hopefully I will be able to generate some usable data at some point to compare the cases.

Sadly at this stage I cannot do independent research on the tissue effects in live tissue. Mainly because the IRB won't let me shoot 100 people in a standard fashion and then do posts. I've mentioned this to my local law enforcement, and they have all volunteered potential candidates from the local criminal community. I still don't think it will get approval though.

Thanks for sectioning that bullet, I was curious as to what was inside. The few I have recovered all look like small commas, bent in the middle, shedding lead from the tail, +/- crushed nose.

[WS6]

That is an important point Dr. Roberts, and sadly, one I don't often have access to. Many of the 7.62x39 bullets in the absence of striking substantial bone exit the body and the projectile is not recovered. Thus determining the actual type of projectile is impossible. The projectiles that are recovered have usually struck intermediate targets or larger bony structures (Spine, pelvis, long bones) and are significantly deformed. As such they can be difficult to identify.

The plural of anecdote is not data, and what I have are just personal observations of multiple GSW made by 7.62x39. However the cases I have seen/performed show substantial injury potential from the 7.62x39 with large temporary expansion cavities and significantly more wounding potential than standard 9mm handgun ammo. I don't know where our shooters are buying their ammo, but I'm guessing it's whatever Walmart sells cheap, just like most other GSWs we see. Hopefully I will be able to generate some usable data at some point to compare the cases.

Sadly at this stage I cannot do independent research on the tissue effects in live tissue. Mainly because the IRB won't let me shoot 100 people in a standard fashion and then do posts. I've mentioned this to my local law enforcement, and they have all volunteered potential candidates from the local criminal community. I still don't think it will get approval though.

Thanks for sectioning that bullet, I was curious as to what was inside. The few I have recovered all look like small commas, bent in the middle, shedding lead from the tail, +/- crushed nose.

Your findings are indicative of yaw. I would expect significantly more trauma than had they remained point-forward, which is what I referenced when I related their wounding capacity to that of FMJ 9mm.

That said, I submit this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8hL3WtKGY8
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNfp2LtfTHc

Please observe the part of the "wound" tracts before yaw takes place.

[AndrewWiggin]

So is it safe to say that most lead core bullets will yaw significantly?

[BufordTJustice]

So is it safe to say that most lead core bullets will yaw significantly?

Not really, since the destabilization is unpredictable.

M67 will be more likely to yaw sooner than M43, but neither are guaranteed to upset.

[AndrewWiggin]

Thank you.

From the article posted earlier, it seems that at the very least, almost any lead core ammo would perform better than M43.

[plouffedaddy]

I shot a test of the GT this weekend.... Should be up this week.

[Nemecsek]

My anecdotal street cop experience is that 7.62X39 rounds create much more devastating damage than pistol calibers. I have no idea what specific bullet or load were used, other than what the empty casings can tell, but the wounds are much nastier.

[DocGKR]

Which 7.62 x 39 mm projectile you are talking about is very important, as the terminal performance can vary greatly.

[DocGKR]

7.62 x 39 mm FMJ:
From L-R: Soviet M43 Type PS steel core (circa 1980’s), DDR Type PS steel core (circa 1970’s), PRC Type PS steel core (circa 1980’s), PRC Type PS steel core (circa 1990’s), PRC lead core (circa 1990’s), Yugoslavian M67 lead core (circa 1980’s), Russian Ulyanovsk 8M2 “Effect” (circa 2000’s), Russian Amursk Cartridge Plant-Vympel “Golden Tiger” (circa 2000’s).





Traditional M43 Type PS 57-N-231 steel core 7.62 x 39 mm FMJ, as well as M67 type lead core FMJ do NOT have significant voids in the nose of the projectile. Recent production commercial Russian FMJ bullets demonstrate a void in the nose. Most M67 type lead core FMJ is shorter than the M43 steel core projectiles, however the Russian Amursk-Vympel produced commercial FMJ loads appears to use the longer jacket of the M43 bullet, but with a lead core, thus resulting in a void in the nose in order to maintain the normal bullet weight of 120.5-124 gr. Testing will be necessary to determine if the large nose void causes a change in terminal performance compared to the traditional, well documented M43 and M67 type projectile wounding capabilities.

[Heavy Metal]

Considering the large air pocket in the nose and the fact it is base heavy, the Golden Tiger Projectile should exhibit a short neck and an early yaw cycle.