Federal ND55664 overruns

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04-18-23, 16:20
vicious_cb

Federal ND55664 overruns

Seems to be some kind of contract overrun or defect training ammo being dumped on the market. The main feature is it seems to be a non-bonded training analogue of the FBI ammo

Features:

Ideal for target practice and training
Accurate and reliable
Non-duty bonded training analog for LE duty ammo

https://media.mwstatic.com/product-i...pg?imwidth=680

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1026091053?pid=981215

Thank you to the "themonk" for excellent documentation in another thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread...45#post3101245

Quote:

Originally Posted by themonk

Follow up on the ND55664 ammo. I received my shipment yesterday. It appears to be a gold dot bullet on a fusion 64gr soft point loading, like it was a mix-up. Powder looks the same. I have a ton of fusion so I pulled a few bullets to take a look. Unfortunately, I just shot the rest of my gold dot.

On Fusion bullets the lead tip sits proud. On these and my memory of gold dot, they just sit flush to help with deformation. I have included pics below. Someone far more knowledgeable than me please chime in. I will get chrono numbers later this week out of a 16" and a 12.5".

Fusion 64gr soft point & ND55664 side by side
https://i.imgur.com/jI6TWrbm.jpg

ND55664
https://i.imgur.com/oz0dab9m.jpg

Fusion
https://i.imgur.com/GwsFYkNm.jpg

Fusion bullet weight
https://i.imgur.com/YyYmdoIm.jpg

ND55664 bullet weight
https://i.imgur.com/75LowHDm.jpg

ND55664 left / Fusion right
https://i.imgur.com/UWwpcfPm.jpg

Fusion Top / ND55664
https://i.imgur.com/jZ1Il78m.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicious_cb

The ND stuff does NOT look like a Fusion/Gold Dot bullet, looks more like a TBBC which would make sense since TBBC is only sold under Federal exclusively while Fusion/Gold Dot rolls out of the Speer line and is rebranded to Federal.

Not sure how a unbonded TBBC would work since the bonding process of the TBBC vs Fusion/Gold Dot is baked vs plated but from what Ive seen from cross sections an unbonded TBBC looks very similar to a Mk318 SOST.

To quote myself from the other thread I suspect this just an unbonded TBBC but Im not 100% sure, other opinions and observations are welcome, I also suspect this would make excellent budget defensive ammo if my suspicions are correct and this would perform similarly to Mk318 which basically a non-bonded TBBC.

I feel like atleast a water jug test would be in order if someone has this ammo and is willing to do it.
04-18-23, 16:32
1168

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicious_cb

Non-duty bonded training analog for LE duty ammo[/I]

To quote myself from the other thread I suspect this just an unbonded TBBC but Im not 100% sure, other opinions and observations are welcome, I also suspect this would make excellent budget defensive ammo

I interpreted that line as bonded ammo that is not intended for duty use. Which means it is seconds, otherwise it’d be FMJ. But, I agree with your broader assessment, which is that it will kill the shit out of whatever needs killing.
04-18-23, 16:38
sinister

I shot lots of Remington and Hornady 55-grain soft points from CAR-15s, and I can say they're both more accurate than Ball and yes, will kill the ever-loving snot out of deer.
04-18-23, 16:53
Defaultmp3

FWIW, the guy I spoke to at Federal confirmed to me that it is indeed a bonded round.
04-18-23, 16:58
markm

I seent this in the other thread, but it's out of stock so...
04-18-23, 17:38
vicious_cb

Quote:

Originally Posted by Defaultmp3

FWIW, the guy I spoke to at Federal confirmed to me that it is indeed a bonded round.

Ah my bad, I interpreted the "Non-duty bonded training analog" as non-bonded training ammo not for duty use . Good to know its bonded atleast.
04-18-23, 17:55
Pappabear

Well that blows, I would have grabbed a case. Looked like some decent ammo for .60/rd.

PB
04-19-23, 07:45
themonk

At some point this week I will try to do some crono through a 16" and a 12.5".
04-21-23, 20:04
ABNAK

I'd have easily bought a 500rd case for that $299 price, maybe two (although I need it like another hole in the head!).
04-03-24, 21:49
bnasty49

I just picked up 300 rounds of this stuff about a month ago from Bereli. It comes and goes. Free shipping too!
04-25-24, 12:05
indianalex01

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicious_cb

Seems to be some kind of contract overrun or defect training ammo being dumped on the market. The main feature is it seems to be a non-bonded training analogue of the FBI ammo

Features:

Ideal for target practice and training
Accurate and reliable
Non-duty bonded training analog for LE duty ammo

https://media.mwstatic.com/product-i...pg?imwidth=680

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1026091053?pid=981215

Thank you to the "themonk" for excellent documentation in another thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread...45#post3101245

To quote myself from the other thread I suspect this just an unbonded TBBC but Im not 100% sure, other opinions and observations are welcome, I also suspect this would make excellent budget defensive ammo if my suspicions are correct and this would perform similarly to Mk318 which basically a non-bonded TBBC.

I feel like atleast a water jug test would be in order if someone has this ammo and is willing to do it.

Since you invited other opinions, I worked at Federal for years. TBBC as you mentioned is a bonded bullet. When you say something is just an unbounded TBBC, you are passing disinformation. There is no such thing as an unbonded TBBC. TBBC is its own bullet. If a bullet isn’t bonded, it doesn’t make it an unbonded TBBC. It is a different round. On to the MK318. It is in no way related to the TBBC. It is a OTM barrier blind round. It is a BTHP. TBBC is not. Mk318 is has a hollow cavity with a solid bottom half made for penetration. TBBC is it own bullet. You are creating a little confusion by the way you are saying these other rounds are versions of the TBBC.
04-30-24, 20:38
vicious_cb

Quote:

Originally Posted by indianalex01

Since you invited other opinions, I worked at Federal for years. TBBC as you mentioned is a bonded bullet. When you say something is just an unbounded TBBC, you are passing disinformation. There is no such thing as an unbonded TBBC. TBBC is its own bullet. If a bullet isn’t bonded, it doesn’t make it an unbonded TBBC. It is a different round. On to the MK318. It is in no way related to the TBBC. It is a OTM barrier blind round. It is a BTHP. TBBC is not. Mk318 is has a hollow cavity with a solid bottom half made for penetration. TBBC is it own bullet. You are creating a little confusion by the way you are saying these other rounds are versions of the TBBC.

Thanks for the info, pretty amazing that we would need to have a former Federal employee needing to clarify their product line since Federal is so forthcoming when describing whats actually in these factory seconds that we need to speculate on what projectile they are using.

Also do you have any info on the history behind on the mk318 projectile lineage? Since the cutaway of the original SOST mk318 projectile shows alot in common with the Trophy bonded bear TIP line? Is it common lineage or just coincidence they share a resemblance?
05-12-24, 01:45
vicious_cb

Quote:

Originally Posted by indianalex01

On to the MK318. It is in no way related to the TBBC.

Since no response was provided, Ill let these pictures speak for themselves:

https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...67lztt14zl.jpg
https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...u8ko2j4pba.jpg
https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...icob70zfie.jpg

Since we are speaking like Dr.Fauci I guess the relationship between these two rounds is just "disinformation" or "conspiracy theory".
05-18-24, 01:34
indianalex01

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicious_cb

Since no response was provided, Ill let these pictures speak for themselves:

https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...67lztt14zl.jpg
https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...u8ko2j4pba.jpg
https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...icob70zfie.jpg

Since we are speaking like Dr.Fauci I guess the relationship between these two rounds is just "disinformation" or "conspiracy theory".

Again, you are wrong. TBBC 62gn (LE223T3) is not tipped and is a flat based bullet. Also it is bonded. MK318 is not bonded and has a Boat tail. As a matter of fact the Mk318 Mod1 doesn’t even have lead in it. Completely different bullets and how they perform. LE223T3 does not and was not made to frag. The M318 is made to frag. The TBBC you have pictured is not a 223 bullet.
05-18-24, 12:00
indianalex01

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicious_cb

Thanks for the info, pretty amazing that we would need to have a former Federal employee needing to clarify their product line since Federal is so forthcoming when describing whats actually in these factory seconds that we need to speculate on what projectile they are using.

Also do you have any info on the history behind on the mk318 projectile lineage? Since the cutaway of the original SOST mk318 projectile shows alot in common with the Trophy bonded bear TIP line? Is it common lineage or just coincidence they share a resemblance?

Most bullets with lead in them look similar. It’s what you don’t see. For example the Federal LE223T3 bullet is bonded. It holds together and and expands when it hits flesh. It’s made to shoot through glass and doors while still expanding. The Mk 318 Mod 0/1 are made to frag on impact creating massive wound channels. The solid copper shank penetrating deeply. The Mod 0 has lead in it. The Mod 1 (Silver nickel plated) has no lead at all. These are open tip match bullets. The bullets shown in another post are not the Federal LE223T3. They are a hunting load. The LE223T3 has a lead all the way to the tip and not a poly tip and or a hollow point. I am just trying to clarify some disinformation.

https://usarmorment.com/223-remingto...se-p-3069.html

https://www.bonefroggunclub.com/prod...leadt556tnb1nl