After looking at the prices for fusion ammo, I'm not switching over. I'd be bothered to pay these prices for Gold Dots.
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After looking at the prices for fusion ammo, I'm not switching over. I'd be bothered to pay these prices for Gold Dots.
Over penetration concerns are overblown IMHO.Quote:
Originally Posted by prepare
Barrier blind duty ammo for 5.56 tends to penetrate equally deeply to duty handgun rounds, if not slightly less deeply.
It's a non-issue.
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.223 Rem Fusion uses the same bullet as 62 gr Gold Dot. AFAIK, the only difference between Fusion MSR and Gold Dot is the nickel plated casing and low flash propellant. Fusion vs. Fusion MSR, not quite as sure, I believe the differences are the primer sealant, harder primers, and different annealing process, all on the MSR.Quote:
Originally Posted by markm
The advantage of Fusion MSR is that it's a lot easier to find than Gold Dot. It also used to be a fair bit cheaper, prior to the pandemic, I remember getting boxes of 20 for 10 USD pretty easily.
I could tolerate that price. I have a handful of boxes of Gold Dots, but I'd like to run a few POI and function tests before committing a clip full for home defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Defaultmp3
There's a legit concern in apartments, townhomes, and subdivision where the houses are not more than a few feat apart. For LE that concern expands even greater.Quote:
Originally Posted by BufordTJustice
If you find a "good" deal it's a $1+ per round.Quote:
Originally Posted by Defaultmp3
Which is exactly my point; LE duty handgun rounds penetrate to the same depth, in media and through barriers, as duty 5.56 rounds. There's no reason to have a repeat of the '86 Miami FBI shootout by using ammo that fails to penetrate deeply enough when quality, bonded 5.56 ammo exists.Quote:
Originally Posted by prepare
To be even more blunt, there are only a few specific reasons to select a non-barrier blind round over a BB round...presumptive over penetration is not one of them.
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I assume you mean in gel type media. I think the concern is misses. A missed shot on a bonded has better odds of going through walls and hitting someone innocent than an OTM might.Quote:
Originally Posted by BufordTJustice
(these are all somewhat far fetched "what if?" scenarios)
I mean in people, barriers (wall studs, car doors, etc), and animals as well, with monolithic solids in rifle cals as a categorical exception (slightly deeper penetration, depending upon specific projectile).Quote:
Originally Posted by markm
A missed shot with a fragile OTM, or even varmint round, is going to traverse SEVERAL interior walls, even if a stud is struck. Frag will radiate in a large, unpredictable cone. At least with a BB round that misses, you have *one* projectile careening through the structure...not 30 pieces like a fragmenting round. And the B round is, categorically, going to not deviate very much in original trajectory. Same can't be said for frag based rounds.
Worries of "over penetration" are indeed far fetched in the world of terminal ballistics. I've got most of the old IWBA Wound Ballistics Lab on PDF (Dr. Fackler's work) wherein lots of data is shared regarding this.
The much bigger question is: will the round expand? Rifle rounds, with their higher velocity, are going to be more likely to be performant in this area than handgun rounds.
The next biggest question is: Will the projectile penetrate deeply enough, even for oblique/obstructed angles, to directly damage vital structures in the body?
All other questions are secondary. Because, if those two conditions aren't met, the threat isn't going to stop very quickly, if at all.
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The box o truth from yesteryear covered this.
Pistol rounds penetrate a lot!
The best prevention is to not miss.