This case seems like it might be the "sweet spot" in terms of a do it all cartridge that 300blk wanted to be. Really interested to see what results you get with testing.
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Senior Member
This case seems like it might be the "sweet spot" in terms of a do it all cartridge that 300blk wanted to be. Really interested to see what results you get with testing.
Senior Member
I agree. If the 277 works in the "real world" like it does on paper it should be a dandy AR cartridge.Originally Posted by turnburglar
I received my used barrel today. I picked it up off another forum and the previous owner says he only had about a hundred rounds through it.
This is a 12.5 inch 1X7 twist with a pistol gas system. It was originally sold by Mad Dog Weapons but I believe it was actually made for them by a company out of Montana called X-Caliber. X-Caliber offers 277 Wolverine barrels in various lengths, twists and profiles and is running a 10-12 week delivery timeframe.
Anyway the fellow I bought from included a few rounds of ammo loaded with Speer 90gr TNT bullets. Chronograph shows about 2450fps. He also sent some ammo loaded with 110gr VMAX. I haven't chrono'ed these yet but will soon.
I used the small handful of 90gr stuff to check function and get windage dialed in. Hopefully over the next few days I'll get the VMAX stuff shot at 50 and 100 yards.
I also found a set of Hornady dies off arfcom. I'll get to reloading ASAP.
More to follow...
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Last edited by Tokarev; 04-24-17 at 16:36.
“The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Senior Member
Here are a couple of simple charts I made using the ballistic coefficients off the Speer website for the 90gr .277 TNT and the 125gr .308 TNT. Muzzle velocities are based off guestimates from a 12.5in barrel.
The 277 has a slight edge in trajectory out to about 350 yards but both cartridges run out of steam at about 400 yards. And the energy numbers are higher for the 300BLK.
300 on the top. 277 on the bottom.
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“The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Senior Member
Nice, I was looking up 6.8 spec trajectories today cause I wondered how it compares to 300blk. Seems the 277 is a 'little' flatter than 300blk.
Is it general consensus that the larger bores do better than 223 in shorter barrels?
I was also looking on midway and found Hornady HPBT 110gr at .23 cents a round. With a bc of 360 it looks like something you could mass load. One of the big things I won't go near 6.8 or 6.5 is a lack of cheap brass. That was a huge draw to 300blk was reloading. .277 wolverine seems like a very good reloaders cartridge. Even if there was another scare it likely wouldn't affect these components.
Manufacturer
Yes, for a given pressure and bullet weight, a larger bore will accelerate the bullet more quickly and get it "up to speed" in a shorter distance.
On a practical level, the minimum viable barrel lengths for each cartridge are:
5.56 - 10.5"
6.8SPC - 8.5"
300BLK - 6.5"
Last edited by Clint; 04-25-17 at 00:38.
Black River Tactical
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BRT Covert Comps 5.56, 6X, 7.62
Senior Member
At this point it is strictly a wildcat although a couple of companies are selling "factory" ammo made on reformed 223 brass.
Making Wolverine brass is pretty much the exact same process as making 300BLK. Chop the 223 case off at the shoulder and then size. Finish trim and load.
Rocky Mountain Reloading has the Nosler 115gr BTHP for fairly cheap as well as some 150gr Federal Fusion bullets. Both would probably be a good choice for bulk reloading. The 115gr should be a good choice for general range work while the 150gr apparently works well for subsonic stuff.
In looking at available .277 bullets it seems the 100gr or 110gr Nosler Accubond or the 90gr Nosler Bonded should work well. These bullets should retain enough velocity from a 12.5in barrel to expand at 200-250 yards.
Mad Dog Weapons has just posted on his Facebook page that his company is now a junior member of SAAMI. I can only assume that this means the 277 is on the path for industry approval.
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“The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Senior Member
I did the 10yd zero with the Red Stag Ammunition 110gr VMAX load and then shot five over the chrono. Average muzzle velocity with this load from the 12.5in barrel is 2,201 fps.
Using Hornady's published BC the ballistics chart should look something like this:
Edit to note about the primers. They're pretty darned flat. Much more so than with the 90gr TNT ammo.
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Last edited by Tokarev; 04-26-17 at 15:39.
“The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Member
I've been looking at .277 Wolverine for awhile, and I think it has a lot more promise, as it offers the same subsonic /supersonic versatility of .300blk, but with supersonic performance nearly identical to 6.8 SPC.
I just wish I could get an AUG barrel in .277, or perhaps an XCR Micro pistol.
.277 Wolverine 110gr VMAX .370 bc @ 2550fps / 1800fps minimum expansion velocity
--> 350 yards = 1796fps
.300blk 110gr VMAX .290 BC # 2350fps / 1800 fps minimum expansion
-->225 yards = 1750 fps
So you get more power at the muzzle, and 125 yards more expansion range over .300 BLK.
Meanwhile, for subsonic, you can get 193gr cast lead, or 175gr expanding copper hollow points.
.277 also works well out of 8.3" barrels:
-Sierra Pro Hunter 110 g: 2038 fps, 24"+ penetration. Notes: Narrow pofile, deep penetration.
-100 g nosler accubond: 2263 fps, Notes: short neck length to max expansion cavities, deep penetration
-90 g Speer TNT: 2200 fps. Notes: 4-5" long neck. different fragments ~16" penetration in clear gel, near total fragmentation and energy transfer in the first gel block.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQtzZsMec1c
.277 Reloading forum for those interested:
http://mdws.forumchitchat.com/?forum=393087
Had the .277 been introduced 10 years ago, there would be no .300 BLK or 6.8 SPC.
Last edited by spyderco monkey; 04-28-17 at 03:02. Reason: more info
Senior Member
I have my first handloads put together with 90gr Speer TNT and 90gr Nosler Bonded Performance bullets. I've stayed on the conservative side with my initial attempt.
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“The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Member
I thought the optimal barrel length for 300 BLK is ~10" where the 6.8 SPC II is ~16" or maybe 18". What is the optimal barrel length for the .277?
How does velocity and energy of the 300 BLK number compare to a 10" barrel 6.8? I am just trying to compare apple �� to apple �� with this.
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